Home page of BPDFamily.com, online relationship supportMember registration here
March 29, 2024, 04:50:05 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins: Kells76, Once Removed, Turkish
Senior Ambassadors: Cat Familiar, EyesUp, SinisterComplex
  Help!   Boards   Please Donate Login to Post New?--Click here to register  
bing
Expert insight for adult children
101
Family dynamics matter.
Alan Fruzzetti, PhD
Listening to shame
Brené Brown, PhD
Blame - why we do it?
Brené Brown, PhD
How to spot a liar
Pamela Meyer
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: The effects of narcissism on health and the motivation behind intervention  (Read 1062 times)
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« on: October 11, 2019, 03:46:14 PM »

I was going to post this in another thread but thought it might merit its own discussion in case others want to add. Talking about the effects of narcissism on health and the motivation behind intervention...I was struck to come across this which was incredibly validating! Be guided by your intuition.

          I was in a very unhealthy marriage to a narcissist for 27 years. He wasn't satisfied with what I gave. The longer we were married I began to become very ill. After my second hospitalisation (where the doctors would not allow my husband back in to see me after 5 days of seeing his behaviour), I believe that God sent me to a very special doctor. You see I still had no idea I was being controlled or manipulated by my husband. Long story short, my doctor informed me that I was not going to live but for a few months in the relationship I was in. My body could no longer function at all due to the circumstances of living with my narcissistic husband for years. But I tried to tell the doctor that I really did want my marriage to work and how I had a 'two year plan' to get him to check in and start participating in life as a husband and a father. 'You don't have 2 years!', the doctor said. Then he gently explained to me about the personality of the man I married and that he would not change. Oh how I cried and cried in his office that day, I was completely broken. The doctor kindly said that I needed to get an attorney right away. I had no means to get any money. He then did something I still am in utter shock over, he offered to give me the money for an attorney. I knew then and there how much danger my life was in.

To date I have been divorced for 5 years. I bear the marks of my decision to get involved with the narcissist and staying with him. Unable to work, I have been on social security disability with severe asthma since the divorce. My mind doesn't function the way it used to, I am very forgetful and easily distracted now. Two hours of hard work and I am spent for the day. Hindsight is 20/20, knowing that I gave the best of me for my husband during my good years, I feel like I am completely useless.

Please please listen to me. If you are in a situation like mine and you have not decided if you should stay or leave, don't wait until it is too late. I am 51 years old with the body of an 80 year old. God be with you all.
Logged
Harri
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 5981



« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2019, 04:52:53 PM »

Hi Jareth  Welcome new member (click to insert in post)

I think following ones gut is important as well.  I also think it is important to take each situation individually.  For some, intervention is the right thing and for others, not so much.  I know you have heard from plenty of people regarding the cons as you have posed.

I understand you have decided to talk with your brother about his wife.  That is fine especially as you seem aware that things may go well or they may not.  Either way, it sounds like you are prepared for the consequences.   Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

EDIT:  can you share the source for the quote you provided above?
Logged

  "What is to give light must endure burning." ~Viktor Frankl
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2019, 05:20:49 PM »

Harri, source for quote is here - in the youtube comments of a video on 'When the narcissist meets a people pleaser'. Written by 'Marcy Shuler' in the comments  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzoAYcVFeqs

There are some very interesting accounts written by men on reddit who have been in relationships with pwbpd/npd and they talk very candidly about the direct effects on their health...fairly disturbing. Some were not even in those relationships very long.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2019, 05:36:21 PM by Jareth89 » Logged
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2019, 08:26:15 AM »

Jareth, I think you have made your point clear- that you think it is the right thing to do for your brother. I know you have heard other opinions, but you have been steadfast in your point and it seems clear to me that this is what you want to do.

None of us are experts in someone else's situation. The best we can do is relate our own situations. You have presented yours. Each of us can decide what steps to take in our own situation.

I too have asked you what your plan is for how to accomplish your goals. You don't need to convince anyone here that this is what you feel is best for you to do. You would only need to know it yourself and I think you do.

I wish you the best in this endeavor and would be interested in hearing how it goes.
Logged
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2019, 02:45:41 PM »

NotWendy I did state my plan already in this thread https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=339972.0  parts of which got moved to https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=340045.0

The health aspects of abusive relationships are rarely discussed. Kudos to that doctor!

Logged
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2019, 06:28:27 PM »

Jareth, I have read these threads and also participated. There seems to be a lot of back and forth between members sharing their experiences and you confirming your decision.

At this point, I think it's very clear that you wish to proceed. When will this happen?

I don't think there is disagreement that being in an abusive relationship has adverse affects. I have shared my concern for my father who was in an abusive relationship and that I did intervene. You are completely free to make this choice to do this too. If you do a better job than I did at this, I would be interested in hearing about it.

What is the best next step for you now?

Logged
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #6 on: October 13, 2019, 07:31:24 AM »

I'm repairing the relationship with my parents, since it fractured over what to do about sil/brother, then a psych will talk to them. Separately I'm talking to a psych about the sil/brother dynamics in preparation for when my brother is able to speak to him and also prepare for sil/parents backlash if he sets down boundaries. A lot to consider and prepare for. I have to raise the issue with my brother myself first but I need family 100% with me, hence the first point. FourWinds said is there anyone else who can talk to my brother except me - that's a good idea but I don't think there is anyone since the number of people who witnessed this is restricted to my family. It's all very tricky.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 07:38:03 AM by Jareth89 » Logged
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2019, 07:36:29 AM »

I hope you will continue to let us know how this goes. Yes, these issues are complicated and people outside the family may not have witnessed them. I think it is a good idea that you are speaking to a counselor who is well familiar with these issues.
Logged
Skip
Site Director
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 8817


« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2019, 10:32:37 AM »

... you could admire the fact that I have his back...as others have done. Encourage, not detract. ..//.. If I can tell my brother about his wife's condition, he can start to spot and offset any harmful behaviours his son might be receiving ..//..  pwBPD - validation, listening with empathy etc etc etc ...been there done that. For the narcissist, it is never enough? How about validation, listening with empathy to the FOO who are often badly treated by the pwBPD and their enabling appendage.

I admire your commitment to your family.  Smiling (click to insert in post)  I think I respect you parents hesitance to intervene - that is admirable, too.  I admire the members who are pitching in to help. The working relationship may not have gelled yet... but I think we all recognize that BPD traits can and often are very detrimental to families, that your position, your parents position, and members posting here are all well meaning and that everyone is trying to do the best for a difficult situation.

Let's keep at this.

Jareth, I think you have made your point clear- that you think it is the right thing to do for your brother. I know you have heard other opinions, but you have been steadfast in your point and it seems clear to me that this is what you want to do.

None of us are experts in someone else's situation. The best we can do is relate our own situations. You have presented yours. Each of us can decide what steps to take in our own situation.

I agree with Notwendy. You received some advice on the downside of what you are suggesting - but it is your choice - we're past that  - and we are here to support you in being proactive..

Let me suggest that we shift the discussion. There are two parts - 1) your most constructive approach to your brother - and - 2) his most constructive approach to his wife. Starting with #2:

My brother's most constructive approach to his wife.

What is happening in his home? Do you have a sense of what he would tell us are his most concerning struggles with his wife? Generally the best way to intervene on anything is to first understand what the person already sees as a problem and one they would like to solve.

For example, you can intervene with an alcoholic on the adverse health effects of drinking, but if he is healthy, it will be hard to get his buy in. On the other hand, if he is underemployed struggling to pay his bills and upset about it, this would be a far better loci to intervene. And if the plan was not just alcohol focused, even better.

See my point?

You know him well. What would most likely tell us are his most concerning struggles with his wife? We know your concerns and priorities. What are his? What problem will he be most receptive to solve?
Logged

 
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2019, 05:08:09 AM »

My parents have not been able to properly engage themselves on the topic of my brother's marriage (and sil's parents), so they don't know what they are dealing with. This is why no action has been taken by them. I'm working with 2 psychs at the moment, one has offered to speak to my parents to explain what the situation is. The concern is the sil's parents (esp father) and how they act as a unit. This is not just a PD spouse case, it's more complex. My parents were not around to witness sil's behaviour so it's all down to me to break into my brother's head.

In terms of problems he talked to me briefly last year about her mood swings and that she can never be wrong about anything. Also that she had developed a neurosis about over-feeding his son because a health worker said he was at the lower end for his weight (he is normal). He criticised her for something and she delivered him a divorce threat and he immediately backed down. He didn't look very happy at that time but he was at least himself, challenging her and talking to me. I have no idea what goes on in their house, he has become very secretive generally and does not confide in us about anything anymore. This will be because she has instructed him in some way. His behaviour has changed noticeably in the space of 12 months. I reprimanded him for their behaviour in December last year and told him that his wife's behaviour was odd all last year and that she had a strange reaction to my medical news. Instead of asking me to explain, he became very uncomfortable and felt the need to leave without further conversation - so what I said had resonated with him. He is aware of her manipulating him because I told him and he bowed his head. Other than this, we have not talked about anything else.

They are not struggling financially (she earns more than him), her parents do the majority of child-minding (her decision) and they holiday with her parents only, not us. My brother is adapting his behaviour to be accepted by his in-laws, he is being moulded. I have to say that anyone making claims that their sil is BPD traits with nobody in the family to corroborate the evidence (except brother), will get maximum scrutiny by most psychs...is not an easy path to walk telling the truth for someone else's benefit. I need to find a way to get my brother to open up to me...a circumstance which will compel him to be honest.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 05:18:46 AM by Jareth89 » Logged
RomanticFool
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Posts: 1076


« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2019, 05:58:23 AM »

Jareth,

This was incredible to read. I have been out of my r/s physically since August. I got involved with a woman whom I suspect has BPD with possible narcissistic traits - or maybe it’s all a manifestation of BPD, I don’t know.

While I was with her my blood pressure medication was doubled, she attacked me physically a few times and shouted at me in the street on a number of occasions. She sabotaged almost every outing we went on ie on long journeys refused to get in the car, trips to the theatre wouldn’t give me my ticket, stood me up for the cinema etc.

When we first got together she was wonderful, an amazing and exciting woman who had a voracious appetite for reading and was a journalist. By the end of the relationship she called me an abuser worse than Epstein and threatened to denounce me all over social media as a narcissist. Since her mother (apparently a narcissist) had abused her when she was a kid she understood that arguing with me was triggering childhood trauma. I tried to stop arguing with her but her silent treatment and demonisation of me were so painful that I felt I had to fight my corner. All that achieved was her turning the screw until she discarded and blocked me on all channels. I was a nervous wreck by the end and suicidal. I called the Samaritans on a number of occasions and fantasised about either harming myself or her for the pain she had caused me. I’m glad to say I did neither and am now attempting to let go of the terrible attachment to her. I feel battered emotionally and I was only with her for a year and had only seen her for a one week holiday during the summer. The rest of the time she was busy devaluing and denouncing me. It is the most painful relationship I’ve ever had and it nearly took me down. I can’t imagine how awful yours must have been over that time frame. Glad you got out of it and I wish you an improvement in your physical and mental health.

RF
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 06:04:04 AM by RomanticFool » Logged

Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2019, 06:21:41 AM »

This was incredible to read. I have been out of my r/s physically since August. I got involved with a woman whom I suspect has BPD with possible narcissistic traits - or maybe it’s all a manifestation of BPD, I don’t know.

I was a nervous wreck by the end and suicidal. I called the Samaritans on a number of occasions and fantasised about either harming myself or her for the pain she had caused me. I’m glad to say I did neither and am now attempting to let go of the terrible attachment to her. I feel battered emotionally and I was only with her for a year and had only seen her for a one week holiday during the summer.

RF it wasn't my relationship, it was written by someone else I just happened to find it in the comments section of a video I was watching on youtube and was struck by it. My brother is in a BPD/NPD relationship (see above post). Sorry you felt desperate and a nervous wreck...those kind of feelings don't escape anyone connected to the situation. Good to know you are out  With affection (click to insert in post)
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 06:38:47 AM by Jareth89 » Logged
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2019, 07:39:24 AM »

Jareth, I think in general we are in agreement that these types of relationships have detrimental effects.

I think in general it is understood that you wish to inform your brother and are making plans to do so.

You have spoken to two professionals about this. What have they advised you to do? Where are you in this plan?
Logged
Skip
Site Director
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 8817


« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2019, 10:29:41 AM »

I've read your post history.

As I understand it:

        1. there are indications that your SIL has BPD traits (or ADHD or OCD)
2. you feel you SIL parents are enablers and/or have traits too
3. There is a two year old child
4. you would like to see your bother take a stand and divorce his wife, get her into therapy and insist that she build a relationship with you
5. Your parents are not encouraging you
6. Your brother has withdrawn from you on the subject
7. Your goal (as I understand it) is to convince your parents to work with you to affect an intervention of sorts to get his wife to treat you better and get into therapy.
8. You are worried about the consequences for you if you take action (but you are brave enough and committed enough not to be deterred or timid
9. You are going to take action - you are looking for validation and support to do this.
10a. You are looking for suggestions on the best way to do this...
                -- or --
10b. You are NOT LOOKIG for suggestions  on the best way to do this... 

Is this an accurate summary?

If not, can you edit is so that we are all on the same age with the same background.

Logged

 
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2019, 03:37:44 PM »



       1. there are indications that my SIL has BPD traits (she dissociates with matters related to abandonment - I'm the only one who saw this)
2.  SIL parents are enablers and/or have traits too - protective of daughter, suspicious of me
3. There is a 3 year old child (son) He says mum is bossy. He did this in front of me once and mum looked like she had been found out
4. I would like to see my brother start talking to me about any difficulties in his marriage and addressing the behaviours that we both saw this year and last year.
5. My parents are coming around slowly - father is open to talking about how to approach brother, but parents not equipped to discuss details (PD an alien subject)
6. My brother has withdrawn from me on the subject, he does not offer information and we do not ask. Has a tendency to minimise or calmly explain away anything that is mentioned (such as wife not visited in months)
7. My goal is to have the support of my parents while I try to get my brother to confide in me so we can get a trusted line of communication open with him that is private (not known to his wife), so that we can analyse the picture and know what we are dealing with. Tell brother we are here to help him and help him work through this. He needs to be educated on his wife's condition - sanity preservation. Get brother to the psych I have lined up...start working on how to help wife and if she can't be helped what next? Discuss all options on the table with psych. Goal is to help wife, not seek divorce.
8. I am worried about the consequences for me if I take action (I am going to pay a price for everything I do and everything I don't do. I get to choose which poison I am going to take).
9. I am going to take action - I am looking for advice/support as situation develops (I will report)
10. I am open to any suggestions/ideas on the best way to do this. I have not worked out how to say it or how to start but am working on it. I want to tell him in the next few days. The psych talked to me for an hour for free a few days ago, he says he is ready when we are.

SIL dissociated facing me when I visited her house after not having seen her there for a while (abandonment). It had been halloween (last year) and she also drew my attention to the windowsill in the living room where some hoarding had been taking place (stress response). It was a cry for help I think. So this might not be difficult to get her the assistance she needs. I dunno what her parents think...maybe they want her to be helped too but see me currently as a threat because I told my brother about some of her actions and he of course told her (this was before I knew she was bpd traits).
Logged
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #15 on: November 16, 2019, 06:48:24 AM »

I think your plan is caring- and that you wish for both your brother and his wife to have help with this issue.

I will leave it to the psychiatrist you mentioned to advise you on how to present this.

I think the best you can do, and anyone else can do- is to offer your plan to them in a caring way. But also keep in mind that as legal adults- they have the autonomy to choose to accept it or to decline it.

This is about as far as anyone can go- once the help is offered- we can not force, arrest, or commit anyone who is deemed to be legally competent. You may not think your brother is in his right mind, but there is a legal definition of this, and as long as he and his wife meet this- you can't force them to participate in a treatment/mental health plan. If he wasn't legally able to make decisions,  you could seek a court order to take custody of him, but I don't think this is the situation.

I called social services about my father's situation asking what I could do. I told them my concerns. However, my father met the legal criteria for legally competent to make decisions. The social worker put it in a way I could understand " your father is legally competent to make his own bad decisions" and as long as he was, I could not make decisions for him. He may not be making what I thought were good decisions, but he wasn't breaking the law in any way and I had no power over his choices. He was a legal adult.

Yes, he was in an abusive relationship with my BPD mother who has NPD traits. . Yes, it had an adverse effect on him. Yes, I was very worried about him and wanted him to get help. Yes, she has many issues that need help and I want her to get help too.

But unless my parents also chose to be helped- this was as much as I could do legally.

No matter how much we want someone to do something that we think is best for them. they still have free choice. At some point we have to decide that this is the best we can do and accept ( not that is it acceptable to us) - accept the fact that they made this choice.

At what point do you feel you have done all you can do?
Logged
Skip
Site Director
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 8817


« Reply #16 on: November 16, 2019, 06:56:18 AM »

Have you considered having the psychologist talk to him by phone? It's a complicated topic and hard to grasp.

Have you considered having him join the "Bettering Board" here to learn tools to better communicate and reach her? That is a constructive move.
Logged

 
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2019, 08:54:36 AM »

Have you considered having the psychologist talk to him by phone? It's a complicated topic and hard to grasp.

Have you considered having him join the "Bettering Board" here to learn tools to better communicate and reach her? That is a constructive move.

I have only just started talking to this 2nd psych because I wanted another opinion after having seen the 1st. I'm thinking about talking to my other SIL about what is going on, I need another family member to talk to who can grasp this, who I can trust and who can maybe offer me some support now and then. I'm not pressing my parents anymore over this because it's ruining my relationship with them. They know what I'm doing. I'm going to reach out to my other SIL.

Skip, thanks I will consider that. The psych said I can give my brother his number, but I wonder if my brother will follow through. Whatever I say to him, it will have to be done in a way that will connect to him and not provoke his defences. Most important issue is that he does not tell his wife. You would think that he might have figured that out but it seems there is a lot I didn't know about the emotional world of my brother.

NotWendy, you are right. All I can do is reach out to him and leave the door open. I just pray that he will be honest with me and will be able to listen to what I need to say to him. I hope he takes my advice to see the psychologist I have lined up. The worst aspect of this is not knowing everything that is going on and his dishonesty. So in the next few days...

Logged
Skip
Site Director
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 8817


« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2019, 09:52:51 AM »

Shifting the tactics a bit (a lot).

Why not make this about you - which is at lot less threatening way to get him and even your parents involved.

Right now it appears to everyone that it is you against her and that you're trying to recruit others to rise against her. You are clearly on record as "done with her" and everyone certainly "gets it" that you would be most relieved to see this family split up.

You are feeling the push back.

Your mom and dad don't want to alienate her and be limited in their access to their son and grandchild. They will tolerate a lot (as most parents will) to be included.

Alternatively, you could announce your desire to mend t he relationship. You will likely get buy in from everyone. Your bother will cautiously open the door to help you.

This puts you on the inside. You will get a lot more support as a protagonist (rather than a the antagonist).

You could start by buying 3 copies of "The High Conflict Couple" ... send one to your bother as part of this and say that this is what you are reading to guide you and you would appreciate him reading it to help her mend the situation with you. If you get traction with that - send one to your parents and tell them that this is what you are reading and appreciate their support in mending the relationship.

Him reading the The High Conflict Couple will be eye opening for him.  It's also not threatening nor does it overtly mention BPD. It was written by a BPD expert for situations like this.
"https://bpdfamily.com/book-reviews/high-conflict-couple"

Everyone wil eventually figure out that this is about BPD traits.

What to you think of this general approach/idea?
Logged

 
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2019, 12:45:38 PM »

Right now it appears to everyone that it is you against her and that you're trying to recruit others to rise against her. You are clearly on record as "done with her" and everyone certainly "gets it" that you would be most relieved to see this family split up.

Yes I think it's normal for SIL's to feel conflicted, I don't approve of the abusive/manipulative behaviour towards my brother but the same time I think anyone with half a heart cries for the person with the disorder - I knew her before her personality shifted. So did brother. Sad. Most upside-down change I ever witnessed. I do not know the extent of the harmful behaviour, that concerns me. I would like to know. I just tell brother that there is nothing he can tell me that will surprise me.

I'm not trying to recruit others to rise against her. It's not me against her (my feelings have changed over time), it's me needing to get this information to my brother that she has this condition. Then he can get clarity and support from us and help from a psychologist. He can start to see the picture in front of him and work out where this is going with professional back up. We can start to work with something. I mean it's going to be a massive shock. There is a concern to mitigate effects on the child.

I think it's a good idea to say to him that I want to start mending the relationship and make things work. I will buy copies of that book if you think it is a good starting point. I don't think he will be enamoured with the title and I anticipate my brother is going to be difficult and stubborn. I just want to get over the first hurdle of introducing the idea that SIL behaviours are not random.

« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 12:57:08 PM by Jareth89 » Logged
Skip
Site Director
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 8817


« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2019, 02:15:16 PM »

You might do best to play the long game.  The are 10 hurdles in a race - the first is building trust and openness.  What I’m suggesting is to "back into this" - not blast out with a piece of informations that will likely shut him down/make him defensive.
Logged

 
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2019, 04:04:14 PM »

I can see the wisdom of doing that. With the way my brother's behaviour has changed over the course of 12 months, I don't think I can let this go on much longer. He will get pulled down deeper and become a shadow of himself. That is already happening. It's causing me anxiety. I have been making positive gestures to my SIL for a few months already, but she always waits for me to do something for her before she engages with me.

He knows most of the behaviour anomalies because he was reporting some of them to me last year. He also knows he was being manipulated. We can start with that, since we already aired it between us. I think 2 years is a long enough time to not blow the cobwebs off this. The effect on him is being amplified by the parents. I'm the only person who can do anything and I can't make myself ill watching. Plus, what if something happens to me and there is nobody left to do this? So I should get on with it and will be extra careful to not put a piece of info out there that will shut him down. I will tell him i've got his back and I support his marriage and son and go from there.
Logged
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #22 on: November 19, 2019, 06:41:05 PM »

Even if I succeed in getting brother to the psych so that he understands everything that is going on, his wife might still reject therapy. If he succeeds with his wife, he still then has the parents to contend with who have been controlling and manipulating him. Wife and parents are tight knit. Even aiming for a happy ending I don't see how this family is going to work - it's not just wife it's the parents. The controlling behaviours I have witnessed are disturbing. The wife is able to control my brother just by staring at him and the FIL is able to provoke behaviours in my brother so that my brother acts in a manner to gain acceptance. I spoke to a guy today who is trained in 'exit counselling/psychology of coercive control' who is also an ex-cult member and has experienced coercive control personally.
Logged
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2019, 07:14:46 AM »

So my nephew tells me today while he is over at the house, 'My mummy says i'm having a baby brother soon'.
Logged
Jareth89
`
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 175


« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2019, 05:34:46 PM »

I've decided I'm not giving my brother a choice in this - giving him a choice or trying to persuade him to see a psych who has already been briefed on his case is not going to work. I'm setting up an intervention whereby he will come to the house and the professional and myself will proceed from there. In the case of my brother, there is no other way to get the professional advice and support to him. It is done with his best interests at heart. He needs to understand the mind control techniques that are being used on him by 3 people who effectively presented a family facade, gaining our trust. Goal is still to help, but there is a need to know about all the behaviours which he is silent about. We don't know whether she is expecting again or if this is something she promised her son in the near future.
Logged
Harri
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 5981



« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2019, 07:43:32 PM »

Hi Jareth.   Welcome new member (click to insert in post)

What sort of professional will you be working with?  I am curious and interested to hear how things turn out for you.  Will this be happening soon?
Logged

  "What is to give light must endure burning." ~Viktor Frankl
Notwendy
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 10440



« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2019, 09:01:34 AM »

Please post how it goes. I am interested in hearing about it.
Logged
Four Winds

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Inlaw
Posts: 42


« Reply #27 on: November 25, 2019, 06:39:16 PM »

Hoping for this to go well with a positive outcome for you and your family.  If I look back over the years at our shattered family bonds and my sad  and helpless brother, I’m not sure if an intervention would have been able to save him. He is just too far under his wife’s jurisdiction.  She is a master manipulator and keeps him firmly under guard and as far away as possible from family and friends that love him.  He has been removed.
Logged
I Am Redeemed
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Divorced
Posts: 1915



« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2019, 08:34:45 PM »

Staff only This thread has reached the posting limit and has been locked. The discussion continues here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=341357.0
Logged

We are more than just our stories.
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2024?

Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Our 2023 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
12years
alterK
AskingWhy
At Bay
Cat Familiar
CoherentMoose
drained1996
EZEarache
Flora and Fauna
ForeverDad
Gemsforeyes
Goldcrest
Harri
healthfreedom4s
hope2727
khibomsis
Lemon Squeezy
Memorial Donation (4)
Methos
Methuen
Mommydoc
Mutt
P.F.Change
Penumbra66
Red22
Rev
SamwizeGamgee
Skip
Swimmy55
Tartan Pants
Turkish
whirlpoollife



Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2020, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!