Looking for support

[Depression = 72% of members]

This puts me in a bind, because some of her new accusations - things she's apparently held for a long time, but I'm just now hearing - are horrendous, and cannot fall into an 'agree to disagree' camp.  And he's straight up asking me to accept them.

O.K., so unfortunately, from what I've learned and experienced, he's right. You do have to straight up accept them... Trying to convince her of your point of view will most likely be too much for her to handle. Instead, what you will receive is blame shifting to a spectacular degree. You will need to accept that her unreality is her reality. Trying to convince her otherwise will be futile. You'll probably get more satisfaction from banging your head against a wall. At least in this case, eventually the wall will knock you unconscious. Well maybe she will too if she's physically abusive at all, like my ex was starting to be.

The other complicating factor is that the day I wrote him, my wife asked me if I was communicating with him behind her back.  (A very 'can you call it paranoia if it happened' situation)  I answered honestly and she responded, rightly so, that it was a betrayal of trust, that we should not be saying things to him in private that the other person was not privy to.  In hindsight I should have totally asked first about contacting him with clarifying questions and concerns.  Then it could have gotten an okay -- or we could have talked decided not to.  But I blew it.  And I promised she would never have to worry about me talking to him one on one in the future, she could set that concern aside.
But man, if I could have a one-on-one session do-over, I would go about it completely different.  I know exactly what I'd say now.

Do you think after the breakdown in the session the other night, you can ask her if it's O.K. to work with him privately so you can "practice" communicating better? Maybe you can play it off like, "this is really stressful for me, and I want to work with him alone." Just a thought.

[EZEarache]

This puts me in a bind, because some of her new accusations - things she's apparently held for a long time, but I'm just now hearing - are horrendous, and cannot fall into an 'agree to disagree' camp.  And he's straight up asking me to accept them.

O.K., so unfortunately, from what I've learned and experienced, he's right. You do have to straight up accept them... Trying to convince her of your point of view will most likely be too much for her to handle. Instead, what you will receive is blame shifting to a spectacular degree. You will need to accept that her unreality is her reality. Trying to convince her otherwise will be futile. You'll probably get more satisfaction from banging your head against a wall. At least in this case, eventually the wall will knock you unconscious. Well maybe she will too if she's physically abusive at all, like my ex was starting to be.

The other complicating factor is that the day I wrote him, my wife asked me if I was communicating with him behind her back.  (A very 'can you call it paranoia if it happened' situation)  I answered honestly and she responded, rightly so, that it was a betrayal of trust, that we should not be saying things to him in private that the other person was not privy to.  In hindsight I should have totally asked first about contacting him with clarifying questions and concerns.  Then it could have gotten an okay -- or we could have talked decided not to.  But I blew it.  And I promised she would never have to worry about me talking to him one on one in the future, she could set that concern aside.
But man, if I could have a one-on-one session do-over, I would go about it completely different.  I know exactly what I'd say now.

Do you think after the breakdown in the session the other night, you can ask her if it's O.K. to work with him privately so you can "practice" communicating better? Maybe you can play it off like, "this is really stressful for me, and I want to work with him alone." Just a thought.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

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[kells76]

This puts me in a bind, because some of her new accusations - things she's apparently held for a long time, but I'm just now hearing - are horrendous, and cannot fall into an 'agree to disagree' camp.  And he's straight up asking me to accept them.

That is stressful.

And there are ways to work with it.

I wonder if what he's asking you to do when he asks you to accept them (and feel free to jump in with exact wording of what he's asking)...

is to accept that that is what she is feeling.

It is really, really subtle.

It's not asking you to accept that it really happened.

It's not asking you to accept it, in the sense of agreeing with it.

It is perhaps more likely that he is asking: "Can you accept that that is how she sees things?"

And THAT gives you something to work with.

From there, you could, in honesty and with integrity, say something like:

"That would feel devastating to anyone if that happened"

"I would also be hurt if that had happened to me"

"Nobody wants to feel like they were betrayed"

"I cannot imagine the pain you are in as you have this experience right here" (or something more skillful)

...

The subtlety is related to how "it is real that we are feeling this way" but "feeling this way doesn't make it real".

The first one -- "it is real that we are feeling this way" -- is the validation target. The second one -- "feeling this way makes it real" -- is invalid.

So finding ways to "accept that she feels that way" is valid. "Agreeing with why she feels that way" is invalid. You didn't do that stuff.

Seeing how someone else would feel bad/angry/hurt/betrayed if they truly believed X had happened is the start of empathy which can dial down the temperature.

I'd steer away from "If X had really happened, I'd feel anguish too".

I think there is a skillful middle ground between "drinking the Kool-aid" and escalating with JADE. Find what's valid and true -- yes, she really does feel that way. Don't validate the invalid -- it is untethered to reality that she feels that way, and agreeing "yes, you feel that way because I was a criminally abusive monster" isn't helping anyone. Slow down, listen for some feelings, maybe try some moves of "it just makes sense to feel anger" or "I'd feel bitter if I'd been hurt".

I'd be curious how your T would respond if you found some validation targets with your W. I suspect she is not going to be able to genuinely do that with you (at least, not right now. One can hope and pray for her to turn to the better in the future).

[AaZz]

(feel free to jump in with exact wording of what he's asking)...

His exact phrasing:  “Your wife WAS subjected to X and you need to accept that.”  (his deliberate emphasis on the ‘was’)

There was no mistaking that he was not referring to feelings or points of view.

However, I also do think it is very worthy to note he did not say “*You* subjected your wife to X and you need to accept that.  He seems deliberate about never phrasing things this way.

This could be his way of saying, “For her, it happened. It IS her reality.”  It also sounds a whole lot like “And you did it, even if you didn’t mean to.”

Regardless of the intentions of his wording, what my wife *hears* is that the therapist believes this is capital T Truth because: “He says you did it.”  And she is insistent that I say specifically “I did it. I own it.” and mean it.  And she’s made it explicit that anything less is invalidation.  In fact anything less is gaslighting and abuse.  So there is no wiggle room for me to say any other construction of phrase.

The odd thing is that for months (years?) she has insisted ”there are things you deny” in reference to this.  But these are things we’ve never talked about before, some things she's never even told me before - I've never had a CHANCE to deny. When she would say this, I would always dodge asking her what she was referring to, because I didn’t want there to BE something for me to deny.  So It really appears that SOME voice has been denying this narrative.  I really wonder if it is a voice inside her that knows it's not true and she has been projecting that voice onto me.  Until a couple weeks ago I've never had to deny any of this, but now that I hear the stories, I’m horrified, and  I DO agree with what might be this second voice inside her that knows it’s not true.

There are a million other things I construct acceptable phrasing for.  I do it multiple times every day.  I figured out how to do it on my own, loong before I knew that it was even a thing, before I stumbled across the right books and videos and podcasts explaining what I had learned to do the hard way.

This one however crosses a line.  And I do NOT feel safe.  If she can construct and believe this - and therapists validate it, and I am expected to accept and communicate to her that it happened - I will NEVER feel safe in the relationship.  And now I know she has already relayed this narrative to no less than six people in our network.  And no one will be telling her, hey this is just one perspective, better not be spreading that. In fact it seems they’ve encouraged her to tell other people.  

Again, I know where this comes from.  My heart breaks for her.  She’s sick and she can’t help it.  She truly, truly believes this.  This is her reality and that breaks my heart.  I literally weep when I think about how for her this a part of her ‘history.’  I even feel like if the therapist could tell me “I know it’s not true, but she *needs* you to play along” that I could do it. I could live the lie.  Or even adopt it as my own reality.  But is that going to help her in the long run?  What if it happens again?  She’s already claiming it happened in two different episodes - the story keeps changing.  And what about my kids?  What if something happened to me, if someday I’m gone, and she needs a new target for her projections?  It’s all so messy.

[pursuingJoy]

This could be his way of saying, “For her, it happened. It IS her reality.”

Yes.

 It also sounds a whole lot like “And you did it, even if you didn’t mean to.”

I know you may interpret it that way, but it may not be what he's saying. Even if it's what he's saying, it is your choice to accept responsibility or not. Counselors don't know everything and they don't always get it right. Only take what is yours to carry.

And she is insistent that I say specifically “I did it. I own it.” and mean it.  And she’s made it explicit that anything less is invalidation.  In fact anything less is gaslighting and abuse.  So there is no wiggle room for me to say any other construction of phrase.

Your wife expects invalidation, to the point that she fights you for it. form flier compares it to a dance - this is the dance your wife is accustomed to. You're changing normal protocol and that makes her anxious. She is fighting to go back to the normal protocol until a new one is introduced and becomes familiar.

There are a million other things I construct acceptable phrasing for.  I do it multiple times every day.  I figured out how to do it on my own, loong before I knew that it was even a thing, before I stumbled across the right books and videos and podcasts explaining what I had learned to do the hard way.

I love it. I think this is just fantastic.

This one however crosses a line.  And I do NOT feel safe.

Can you share specifically what this is about? It's true that some accusations need to be handled with more care than others.

[AaZz]

Can you share specifically what this is about? It's true that some accusations need to be handled with more care than others.

Here goes.  

Potential trigger warning…

She claims I sexually abused her, dozens of instances over a period of time, that I forced her to have sex when she didn’t want to.

I know this cannot be a matter of interpretation.  Since 2013 to the present day - which includes the time frame she’s referencing - I have lived by a commitment never to initiate.  

Since week one of marriage (2 decades ago) I had figured out that all the signs of repressed memory sexual childhood trauma were there.  I’ve tried to carry the weight of that in different ways in different seasons - tried to be mindful of how that could impact her and worked to keep the weight of that off her and onto me.

Explaining all the complicating factors would be a giant post (one I actually wrote and then deleted).  I am happy to provide.  But for now, for the sake of brevity, with much left out:

In one season of life, my wife was insistent that I have sex with her.  ALL throughout this time I was highly concerned.  I sensed she did not want to be there, but she insisted.  If I expressed concern I was attacked with “you don’t like me, you don’t want to be with me.”  If I said it didn’t seem like she wanted to be there she would say “You want me to engage with more enthusiasm. You are rejecting who I am.”  One time she was even crying and my attempts to stop were met with frantic abandonment accusations.  It was crazy. I was so confused.  Because I was convinced she didn’t want to be there, very early on I internally vowed never to initiate so I couldn’t be blamed for making her do something she didn’t want to do. I knew nothing I about BPD back then, so I was so confused.  All I knew was * I * didn’t want to be there, but I could never say that because she ferociously impugned my love and care and concern for her.  I began to dread these encounters, I felt gross and disgusting - her accusations became self fulfilling prophesies..  

This was a season and I eventually managed to end it. Within the last couple of years she has gotten her own therapist, and they are indeed unpacking all sorts of repressed childhood abuse.  I’m so glad she is finally getting this help she needs.  

But in discussions about sex, she is also painting that other time period years ago through a dissociated victim lens. She is telling her own therapist, plus our couples therapist, plus multiple friends that I forced her to have sex with her, that I sexually abused her.  I know there are SO many complicating factors.  And I’m learning how a bpd mind works.  So I can make myself see how she looks back at this through a certain filter, or how it could feel like this was the case.  But I feel like there is no way can I get on board with the words “forced” or ‘sexually abused.”  That’s not an ‘agree to disagree’ area.  If we were to say she experienced “sexual trauma” during that time - I could agree absolutely.  That was MY great concern at the time - one that kept being denied!  I was convinced that harm was being done, but I was attacked for trying to talk about it.  I was the one who put a stop to it when I became convinced I couldn’t trust what she was saying.

Again, my heart breaks for her.  It always has.  I’ve spent my life trying my best to surrender myself to her needs and perspectives.  That’s what I did back then.  When I accepted her words that “You saying no communicates that I am not good enough for you” I let go of my perspective of what was going on and surrendered to her accounting.  And now THAT is the very period of time we are talking about, but the story is flipped.  All of her insistence and pressuring is being denied.  And I’m being asked to do the SAME thing again: to accept her new words.  To now say that during that time “She was sexually abused, she was forced.”  This feels is like it perpetuates the cycle, not breaks it.

[pursuingJoy]

Thanks for sharing, AaZz, and for the trigger warning. I survived sexual abuse as well and it's taken a lot of work to heal. You've been through a lot as well, my friend. My heart goes out to you both.

One time she was even crying and my attempts to stop were met with frantic abandonment accusations.  It was crazy. I was so confused.

Sexual abuse is about power. This almost sounds like she's trying to flip the script - she wants to be the one to gain power over her abuser and this is how she's trying to achieve that. In the same way she's pushing you to invalidate her, she put you in the position to become the abuser. She is hurting. I really feel for her, and I know you do too.

She is telling her own therapist, plus our couples therapist, plus multiple friends that I forced her to have sex with her, that I sexually abused her.

Can't speak for the friends but is it possible that her therapist and your couple's therapist have an inkling about what's really going on? It isn't rare for sexual abuse to lead to this type of behavior later in life.

And I’m being asked to do the SAME thing again: to accept her new words.  To now say that during that time “She was sexually abused, she was forced.”  This feels is like it perpetuates the cycle, not breaks it.

It would perpetuate the cycle so change the rules and play the game in a way that's true to your values. What to say and what to accept is your choice and yours alone. Think about what you're validating. Don't validate the invalid. Don't accept what is not yours to carry.

I'd document as much as possible, somewhere she won't find your notes. Tell a trusted friend what's been going on. Think about ways to protect yourself. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

[AaZz]

Again, potential triggers…

Maybe this is too far down the post at this point for anyone to see and I need to start a new post.  Because, given the topic at hand, I do not know how to navigate this.  ***Is there anyone else who has been in the same spot?  How does one handle it***

I know how to validate, I do it all day long, week after week, year upon year.  But this seems different - is it?  Is it not?

My wife’s niece recently had an episode that seemed to come from nowhere, claiming that when she was a child her dad would take off and abandon the family for days, weeks.  Her mom, dad, brother were like, “what the heck? We know he didn’t. We all lived here together, we know that didn’t happen.”  But they knew she believed it so they didn’t argue, let it slide, her dad took the hit, they tried to understand where she was currently at and what she currently needed.  However, if the claim had been sexual abuse, that would have required a far different response. It would HAVE to. You can’t agree to disagree on something like that.

My wife’s brother sent his mom emails and texts untethered from reality about her having a relationship with her neighbor, about this neighbor threatening him, about his parents saying all manner of terrible things about him.  In curse-filled rants he told her he’d never step into her house again and he was cutting everybody off.  Now, a couple years later he is telling everyone that his MOM forbid him to step foot in the house (even though she has the emails) and that the whole family cut HIM off.  My wife was so upset by this, wondering how he could lie like that, and I had to keep telling her “I don’t think he’s lying, I think he honestly believes everything he says.”  So the family doesn’t argue with him and just tries to tell him they love him now.  They let it slide.  However if the claim had been about sexual abuse, you can’t treat that the same way, can you?

I’m even trying to think of my own scenario —  when I told our couples therapist that I felt betrayed, like he was throwing me under the bus, he responded with, “I apologize for the hurt and betrayal that this has caused for you, and that you are experiencing the feeling of being thrown under the bus.”  I feel like he was responding honestly, and also trying to model what validation looks like.  But if I were to say that he had sexually abused me in our first few sessions, that would have been a faaaar different claim, required a far different response, and I imagine there would have been all sorts of other people brought in and protocols put in place.

On the other hand, I also feel like given the topic, benefit of the doubt gets thrown out the window - and probably rightly so?  One conversation with a confidant went like this:
“She says I don’t care about her.”
“You know your heart; she’s dealing with hurts that keep her from seeing it.”
“She claims I said such and such”
“You know the truth, you know what you actually said, she’s got things going on inside that are mixing everything up.”
“She says I forced her to have sex.”
“Oh, well, you probably did.”

This is so serious, you don’t mess around.  And I get that.  If it came from anyone else, if it was about another person, I know MY response.  If my daughter said her husband abused her, I wouldn’t try to figure out if it’s true.  I’d say, “Leave.”  If my wife said a boss abused her, I’d say leave, “Leave.”  If my wife says I abused her, my knee-jerk reaction,  I think LEAVING should take place.  Not because I don’t love and care for her - I just know that’s the correct response.

But she’s not going to leave.  And she doesn’t want me to leave - what drives all this in the first place is abandonment issues, you don’t care about me claims, I can’t care for myself and no one else does either.  Leaving would confirm all this in her mind.  He never cared about me.  At this point, it isn’t about should I stay or leave.  I’m planning to stay.  I’m not abandoning her.  I love her deeply, and even knowing the depth of her pain causes love to grow, not lessen.  But how do you live with someone who reads ill intent into everything?  How do you live with someone when the ill intent in their mind has crossed THIS line.

Has anyone here navigated THIS kind of scenario?

My hope was couples counseling was going to help with the misperceptions going on in life.  But we are now dealing with claims that have come up during counseling that I have never heard before.  What was frustration has turned to shock and horror.  When I tried to share this I was told by the counselor  “She WAS sexually abused - you need to accept that.”  I don’t know that couples counseling will help.  Has anyone here navigated a similar situation?

[pursuingJoy]

But this seems different - is it?  Is it not?

I'm not sure it's so different. The allegations are such that you want to take reasonable measures to protect yourself. Have you researched marital rape laws in your state? Would it even come to that? What's the worst case scenario if you follow the counselor's guidance in validating her?

It's really interesting that your wife's family has had so many parallel stories, where they completely fabricate information. I also find it ironic that she can see her brother's lies, but not her own.

On the other hand, I also feel like given the topic, benefit of the doubt gets thrown out the window - and probably rightly so?  One conversation with a confidant went like this:
“She says I don’t care about her.”
“You know your heart; she’s dealing with hurts that keep her from seeing it.”
“She claims I said such and such”
“You know the truth, you know what you actually said, she’s got things going on inside that are mixing everything up.”
“She says I forced her to have sex.”
“Oh, well, you probably did.”

Friends often don't understand BPD.

How do you live with someone when the ill intent in their mind has crossed THIS line.

Has anyone here navigated THIS kind of scenario?

Has anyone here navigated a similar situation?

I know others here have dealt with similar accusations - there are several threads, I'll try to find them for you. Let's try to get you connected to them, maybe start a new post or comment on their threads.

Do you think she is staying because on some level, she knows what she's saying isn't true?

What part of this is about you? What do you fear, and how do you face it?

[olafinski]

Hi,
first I must say that your list at the beggining sound almost totally like my wife. We did not get to counseling, either together or individually, because my wife comes from an old school medic family (her father is a retired oncologyst) and “we do not believe in psychotheraphy). Btw his sister commited suicide recently….
I have “diagnosed” her as having a highly-functioning BPD. We are together for 14 years. She has a son from her first marriage, so for a long time I thought that her behaviour is in fact “testing” me because as a mother she would not be with someone that will just go away one day.
Off course, her strange behaviour never stopped, even after we got our son and I displayed total loyalty no matter what.
Our case is perhaps a bit peculiar because I was in a dark ace when we met, thinking I will never have a family of my own, and also got diabetes T1 at 35. She really helped me a lot and gave my life a new meaning, and our son is the greatest miracle. There is really nothing I wouldnt do for him.
So, to the point.
When I realised that my wife has mental issues, I started looking at everything in a different way. SHE needs my help. She can mever have a normal relationship. But she CAN have a life. She just needs a partner that understands her condition and can tolerate it.
So when se goes “off” (I learned the signs), I switch “on” and start treating her like someone that needs help, so my needs and feelings are not important (currently). Whatever she says, I don’t take in personally. It’s just words. I know that she will not remember it. The most important thing is not to bite the bait and get into and argument. Just acknowledge that she is right and that everything is as she says it is. So there is never a “fight”. It is just her dashing out at me and being a bitch for couple of hours. Then it is over and all is good.
I even taught our son about it, in carefully picked way, and so far it works fine.
Off course if someone else would see it he would probably think we are all crazy

[AaZz]

I also find it ironic that she can see her brother's lies, but not her own.

You have no idea.  At times it would be comical if it weren’t so confounding.  There have been instances when she has been sharing something her brother said / did, talking about how clearly wrong it is.  And then literally in the very next conversation, less than a minute later, she has said / done the EXACT same thing.  I have to make sure I don’t stand there with my mouth open.  I have no idea how she can’t see the parallels.

Of course I know never to reference any of this.  She would say (has) that I am using information about her family against her.  How dare I compare her to someone with clear problems, etc etc.  It’s all evidence of how I’m out to demean her, oppress her, try to spin things, etc.  Any mere sniff of a comparison to her brother is seen through a victimization lens.

Do you think she is staying because on some level, she knows what she's saying isn't true?

I have no idea what she thinks at any given time.  It seems to keep changing.  Her view of the past seems to be influenced by who she’s been talking to, what she’s been reading, how she currently feels about herself and life. There’s a darkness which I recognize when it comes that informs me of a one hundred percent chance that she’s been reading something triggering / perception-shaping that day.  Of course, sprinkled over the decades, she will from time to time  have little moments of clarity - an “oh my gosh, I can see you, I can see what I’ve been doing to you” moment.  But these are super sort lived and very rare.

I know others here have dealt with similar accusations - there are several threads, I'll try to find them for you. Let's try to get you connected to them, maybe start a new post or comment on their threads.

I would love to connect with anyone that can give some clarity.  I can try poking around the archives too, try searching words or phrases that might yield results.

What part of this is about you? What do you fear, and how do you face it?

That’s a great question.  I spend so much time shelving myself, rolling over, accommodating, setting feelings aside — I don’t know how to think about me, my feelings, my fears.

I know for me primarily this is about her - how can I help her, how do I make sure she doesn’t experience this again, if I accept/validate/own/adopt her narrative  does that make it more likely that something similar will play out again in the future (you did it before, you just did it again).

I do think by default my mind races to focus on her in order to protect myself from facing my own hurts and wounds.  And actually, maybe it’s good that the accusations have finally reached this level.  I have no choice.  I *HAVE* to think about how a false claim this large would/will impact me.  Just rolling with false assertions can’t be an option any longer.  There are potential legal, relational, societal consequences at stake for the first time.

Maybe that’s the whole crisis - I don’t know how to think about me.

On a practical level, I know I will never feel safe with her again in the sexual realm.  Never, ever.  No way.  If this is her perception, one that she hangs onto, one that others validate, one I’m expected to accept — I will NEVER feel safe.  Even if things seemed fine, HOW COULD THIS BE SPUN someday down the road?  And I’ve seen how quickly other people affirm it.  My brain will never move past that.  So yeah, that’s a feeling.

[kells76]

AaZz, tricky spot you're in. It almost sounds like you need a combo lawyer-therapist-coach. Someone to bridge that gap between working on the relationship, and understanding where your red line is.

I *HAVE* to think about how a false claim this large would/will impact me.  Just rolling with false assertions can’t be an option any longer.  There are potential legal, relational, societal consequences at stake for the first time.

Many lawyers will do an initial consultation (often 30 minutes, sometimes more -- I think ours was almost an hour?) for free or very low charge, with no requirement to retain services. If you're having questions/rumination/anxiety about "what if she does it, what if she takes these accusations public", it might help to talk to a legal professional to understand your options and some potential scenarios.

If any kind of "unwinding the relationship" or separation becomes a possibility, as I'm wondering from reading this:

On a practical level, I know I will never feel safe with her again in the sexual realm.  Never, ever.  No way.  If this is her perception, one that she hangs onto, one that others validate, one I’m expected to accept — I will NEVER feel safe.  Even if things seemed fine, HOW COULD THIS BE SPUN someday down the road?

then hearing from a lawyer ahead of time about fielding false accusations could help you sleep a little better -- you know some likely outcomes, you know some tools to use and tactics, you know what to say and what not to say. Perhaps in a consultation, you could let the L know "hey, I am doing counseling with my W, will any legal issues come up in separation if I say stuff like 'how you feel makes sense' or 'I see how real it is to you that this happened' etc?"

Basically, while the worlds of counseling and law are often far apart, if you get some legal info, you can start making informed decisions about what you want to say, what you want to affirm, how to protect yourself, how to validate what's valid and not validate what's invalid.

These consultations would be confidential, and not something, unfortunately, to share with your W.

Good to hear from you again.

kells76

[pursuingJoy]

I have no idea what she thinks at any given time.  It seems to keep changing.

In my experience this is one of the most unsettling, insidious things about pwBPD. The thing is, they can be convincing. It's not like they admit that they're insecure, in fact they often come across as very confident and assured, until they change their mind with equal assurance and you're left spinning, thinking you're the one in the wrong, or the one with the problem. I was shocked at how easily someone else's BPD devastated stability and confidence I'd worked hard to achieve.

 

I do think by default my mind races to focus on her in order to protect myself from facing my own hurts and wounds.  And actually, maybe it’s good that the accusations have finally reached this level.  I have no choice.  I *HAVE* to think about how a false claim this large would/will impact me.  Just rolling with false assertions can’t be an option any longer.  There are potential legal, relational, societal consequences at stake for the first time.

Maybe that’s the whole crisis - I don’t know how to think about me.

Super insightful that you recognize part of the crisis is that you don't know how to think about you, and that you're racing to focus on her to avoid addressing your own hurts. Anyone here will tell you that regaining your foothold one of the most important things you can do. You have some healing to do and you're responsible for that.

It's not always a bad thing to have your back against a wall - sometimes it puts you in a position to make a big, make-or-break decision. The important thing to remember is that you have multiple options to choose from. Each option has accountability/responsibility attached to it. It's a matter of choosing the option that is best for you.

kells's suggestion about the lawyer is a solid option - I think it's important that you go  into this with eyes wide open, knowing the impact and potential ramifications. It could dispel fears - maybe it's not as bad as you think.

As far as the social impact, sure, some people will believe her. BPD's are good at convincing others, until they're not. My reputation has been run through the mud (I do mean RAKED, dragged, pretty viciously), twice. I survived both times. People saw through the lies. It can be nerve wracking but it wouldn't ruin you. Don't let fear control the decisions you make.

On a practical level, I know I will never feel safe with her again in the sexual realm.  Never, ever.  No way.  If this is her perception, one that she hangs onto, one that others validate, one I’m expected to accept — I will NEVER feel safe.  Even if things seemed fine, HOW COULD THIS BE SPUN someday down the road?  And I’ve seen how quickly other people affirm it.  My brain will never move past that.  So yeah, that’s a feeling.

I'd have a hard time getting past this to build intimacy again. She's broken trust, and it's not easy to repair.

I know there are counselors that specialize in sexual dysfunction. I wonder if she'd be open to that? Perhaps you could pose it as wanting to repair/improve your sex life.

[pursuingJoy]

I found just a few threads featuring wild accusations of rape or physical abuse. If you click on their profiles, you can see all of their other posts too.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=220652.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=209359.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=284708.0