You shouldn't feel guilty for this, any more than you'd feel guilty for telling a toddler throwing a tantrum about candy that there's none left, when you know there is some.

He's putting you in an impossible situation, and you're managing it on behalf of your kids, who's welfare is the priority of any parent.  They should be his priority too, but since he's not capable of considering that, or acting appropriately, it's up to you.   

You need to get over the guilt so it's not clouding your own judgment.

I look at it this way: you owe your partner, and especially your spouse, some respect, honesty, and trust.  However, when they've repeatedly demonstrated by their actions they're not deserving of it, self-preservation and protecting the children of the relationship takes a precedent.  When your kids are too young to fend for themselves, sometimes that means you need to take care of yourself as well to ensure you're there for them. 

To add- pwBPD have difficulty with uncomfortable emotions and turn to external sources for relief- and in that moment, they just want relief. They are focused on their own feelings. There's also emotional immaturity.

Another analogy is the Madeline children's book where when the other children see all the attention and presents Madeline gets- they want their appendix out too. They have no idea what that really involves- the pain, the surgery. They see the attention.

Prior to my father's serious illness, BPD mother was the main focus of attention from her family and friends who were in the role of emotional support/caretaker to some extent, but my father, and also us adult children- we were the main people she looked to.

It was obvious to most people that this was a very stressful situation for all who were connected to my father, including my mother but the natural course of events was that the focus shifted to him.

For my BPD mother, this meant a decrease in emotional caretaking for her, but not a decrease in her emotional discomfort. So, her BPD behavior increased and also like the Madeline story, she sought attention.

It baffled me at the time, since I didn't understand BPD as well- how a mother could not see that her children also were emotionally affected by this situation.  Why would she do hurtful things ?

For your partner- you were feeling the emotional loss of your friend at the time. What he percieved was your change in attention and focus from him and on to your friend. He felt his own emotional discomfort increase, and so did what he saw would get your attention back to him. You told him it was difficult for you- that wasn't his focus. Whether he meant it or not, one doesn't know.

This was more than you could manage emotionally at the time, but you are only human, it was a human response. I also said some regrettable things to BPD mother when I got upset with her, things I would not normally say, but it also was in difficult circumstances.

For a pwBPD, the response to this can be projection- all that back at you. My mother also called up her family and friends and told them I said horrible things to her. BPD mother would periodically stop speaking to me and then reconnect.

Why you when it appeared your ex had other people in his circle? My BPD mother did too. However, BPD affects the closest relationships the most. You were the intimate partner- so you were the closest. It wasn't personal to you, but that you were this main person at the time.

Well...another Mother's Day   (Happy Mother's Day....I hope you made the best of) I have a weird topic, and I wonder if anyone would have a thought....my 26 y/o pwBPD (daughter) does not even respond to my texts anymore (this has been at least 9 months) (I have mentioned before) attached herself, to my mother (this is a great thing, my mother let's me know how she is), my sister (I still cannot wrap my brain around this....she DESPISED my sister, many years) and my niece (a very sad story (I know this sounds very negative, my niece had a very sad episode where her husband died (long story) and I was going to take her to dinner, my washer broke and I had wet clothes all over my basement (I took the clothes to a laundromat), thereby, missing dinner. my very favorite niece UNFRIENDED me (you can't make this up), again, pwBPD despised the niece, between my sister & niece she would beg to leave family dinners, etc. in any case, I already knew not to expect any Mother's Day acknowledgement (the first year I checked my phone ALL day) however, I saw a post from pwBPD, with my mother, sister, niece, saying Happy Mother's Day....I do not know if I am overreacting, but (I just want to cry, again) I just found that so hurtful (who are you Happy Mother Daying?) I have researched BPD....does it really make one CRUEL? because I took that as a slap....it just ruined my whole day (if I am being overly sensitive, feel free to tell me

Hotchip- here are two articles that might help you process what happened.

https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/karpman-drama-triangle

and another analogy story of the possible dynamics-

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=65164.0;all

In my situation, it was with a parent, so this is a long term relationship and one doesn't "divorce" a parent. Some adult children go no contact for their own emotional safety. In my situation, I didn't do that. It was BPD mother who would oscillate between being angry at me and then not - the "push pull" dynamics.

Although my BPD mother had mental health care- it wasn't effective with her for several reasons, - BPD was not well known at the time she started it, and also she herself could not process that anything that happened in a relationship had anything to do with her. She was in "victim" perspective- and any issues were someone else's fault. This also involved "projection" of aspects of themselves on to someone else. Without the ability to look inward, or motivation to work on that, that impacts the effectiveness of therapy.

So, if there was any idea of mental illness- although she might agree to attend therapy- she also would present us as the ones with the mental illness, and she did with me, several times. She did make some threats of self harm and we did call emergency when we were concerned. I agree with that advice but I'm focusing on the dynamics here.

We are human and have our own emotional capacity. There's also the "boy who cried wolf" phenomenon, with multiple threats a day.

Most of the time, I didn't react in anger at BPD mother. Regardless of the situation, I didn't want to be disrespectful to a parent. However, my father had passed away.  I was grieving, emotional. I didn't have much tolerance for BPD mother's behavior at the time. I yelled at her and she reacted to that.

To parallel your situation- you had just lost a friend to the unthinkable. You were not in a good place emotionally- which would be expected. I think a non disordered person can understand that someone who has experienced a loss is having a hard time themselves, but someone in victim perspective doesn't. If you have been their emotional sounding board and now, you aren't doing that, they perceive it as you doing something wrong to them.

My BPD mother also reacted by telling people I was emotionally disturbed. In a way she wasn't wrong- I was upset- but for a normal reason. You were too, but where you assumed your partner would understand, he did not. If he was used to making a threat, or sharing your emotions, he still expected it, and when it didn't work, he had an extinction burst- "pushed the button" over and over again.

I think counseling is a great idea for anyone who has been in a relationship like this. With the victim perspective/projection/blame - it's hard to not blame yourself. I think it's fair to call behavior that is hurtful "abuse" even if the person doesn't intend it to be- when it has an emotional affect on the other person. Eventually the other person reacts to that. If someone is being physically hurt, they may react by fighting back, even if they aren't someone who usually does that.

In this situation, it seems you are in general, a caring person and your partner became dependent on your emotional caretaking. When you were in a situation where you needed someone to be empathetic to you, you assumed, like one normally would, that your partner would be empathetic to you as well. However, he couldn't be and his emotional needs continued.

You have a lot to process- the loss of a friend, and the ending of a relationship with a disordered person. That doesn't mean anything is "wrong" with you. It's a lot to process. Therapy can be a supportive situation for you to work through this. It's OK to post here too, but I think the one on one with someone also can help.

Here, we don't apologize for processing our feelings and emotions.  Everyone here arrived a complete wreck in need of support and a community who would understand what unique things they're facing with a BPD in their lives.  For me, that was 3 or 4 years ago when my BPD ex suddenly walked away.  I was a complete mess and genuinely appreciate all the voices that made me feel normal.

Not that I was okay, mind you, but because people could relate to me and understand exactly what I was going through.  Before finding this site, I really thought that my problems were unique and nobody could possibly understand.  I was pleasantly surprised to learn that I was very wrong.

So please keep venting, sharing what feels relevant, and continue to ask questions.  Some people post here just to write and get it recorded on paper (well, virtually anyway).  All of it is perfectly okay.


With BPDs, they say and do things in the moment to gain sympathy however they can.  Why?  Because they're crushed in spirit and can't stand their emotional state.

For example, my BPD ex told others that I abused her.  But then I thought back and she told me that all of her ex's before we got married abused her as well.  She painted those guys as horrible people and it suddenly sunk in that she's described me that way as well, even when we were still married and everything was good.  If she was off, she'd bad-mouth me so others would feel sorry for her.  And to be honest, I doubt she thought anything of it in the moment, like those lies don't stick around for years or decades.  

Many of her relatives seemed to dislike me and I never understood why...but now I get it.  People talk and stuff like that lingers.

My BPD daughter (yes, I hit the BPD jackpot) does the same thing- when you cross her (or she perceives it that way), she's going to talk incredible amounts of trash...some of it that she doesn't even believe.  It's an emotional release to say horrible things I guess.  When my kid was around 10, she told a neighbor that I had been abusing her for years.  The police and social services came, interviewed and checked out my kid (plus interviewed her younger sister), checked out our house, and left without saying another word.  I didn't find out until years later what that was actually about.  Yet I'd bet a dollar that the old neighbor still hates me decades later.

It is wildly frustrating and completely unfair, but hopefully you realize that this isn't actually about you.  If your person was single, he'd say that stuff about his boss, his mom, his neighbor, or whoever he felt was "ruining his life" in the moment.  If he was with another woman, he'd do the exact same thing....regardless of how good or bad that person was.

That's just what BPDs do when they're disordered.  And because they feel terrible in that moment, they never see a reason to go back and tell the truth to the person they lied about you to.  Heck, most of the time I think they forget about it, even though their words live on and cause chaos down the road.

hotchip,

I had a uBPD ex-h. He passed away of natural causes through poor lifestyle choices and his refusal to get care for a serious heart problem. He claimed he was going to unal!ve himself many times when he thought I was going to leave him. He used it like a control mechanism to get me to stay. He was not the type who would go through with it.

It's natural and healthy to try to deal with the aftermath of these overwhelming relationships.  You can try self-help like a 12 step program (Al-Anon or Codependents Anonymous) or attending services for whatever faith appeals to you until you are able to get therapy.

In my case I told myself that I'm in charge of myself and my own life. I have a right to not help anyone but myself. Adults are obliged to take care of their own lives. I am not a babysitter and I will not put up with moochers and freeloaders. 

In my ex's case, his behavior was intentional.  I had a dBPD mother and I'd guess her's was not.

Regardless if intentional or not, the controlling behavior makes you feel you have no personal agency. I needed distance from the relationship and build up trust in myself (self-confidence)  that I would not allow myself to be used by a disordered, unscrupulous person again.

The above mental exercise is excellent to remove yourself from your subjective emotional turmoil and do your best to look at your situation objectively, also known as Thinking Outside the Box.  This variant of Time Travel enables you to gain a more complete perspective about all the factors and issues.

A similar concept is to imagine a good friend is mired in a problematic relationship identical to yours.  Picture that and then ask yourself... What would I recommend to my friend?

Usually both threats and suicidal talk are made in private scenarios, typically without witnesses.  When you do try to reach out for emergency services, the other is very likely to Deny, possibly even Project it onto you.

So, if at all possible have witnesses, as hard as that is.  An alternative is to (unobtrusively) record the threats or suicidal talk so there is documentation of what caused you seek help.  Otherwise, predictable Denials will result in little or no action.

I recall one time when I and my spouse had just left my cousin's home and she got triggered and started hitting me on the head as I drove down the highway.  Well, I "missed" our exit and the next exit just so happened to be the local hospital's exit.  I drove up to the ambulance entrance and reported what was happening.  She of course refused to get out of the vehicle.  Staff declined to take enforceable actions - adults have rights to decline services after all and I didn't have proof of what I reported - and so I was told the police would be called if I didn't leave the ambulance area.  I learned my lesson.  Have some sort of documentation to get action.  This was before smart phones existed, so I bough a digital voice recorder.

(I really apologise for spooling all my thoughts into this mammoth thread. I am looking into affordable counselling options - there are a few cashflow issues, which also I believe exacerbated problems in relationship with uBPDx - I plan to be in formal telehealth counselling to address codependency issues by August.)

One thing which I am still sort of processing. I've mentioned the toxic and harmful action I did, when I shouted at uBPDx to '________ing kill himself' (and then immediately retracted it).

Something that happened after this was that uBPDx called and spoke to a number of his friends and people he and I knew in common, telling them I had said this terrible thing, and most/ all of them counselled that I was unstable and abusive and encouraged him to cut me off.

It was absolutely his right to share a seriously harmful thing I had done and seek outside support. But I have resentment that in the weeks and months beforehand, as I've mentioned upthread, he had been sharing suicidal thoughts and ideation with me sometimes multiple times per day, like at least a hundred times. I had told him that this was very hard for me, and he had brushed this off and continued to do it, and I had tried to connect him with other mental health resources eg access to publicly funded healthcare and he had ignored it, and suggested looking things up online and he ignored that too.

i don't think it was intentional or conscious, but from my perspective, it almost felt like being 'set up'. Like, I know that '________ing kill yourself' is a terrible thing to say, but I also know I would not have said it if it hadn't been said to me and in my presence again and again and again and again in the weeks preceding.

And I never did say it again, after that incident. but he continued to pour his darkness and suicidality into me, and to ignore or resist any other forms of support or treatment (besides occasional meditation, and only after I insisted).

it made me angry because when he was calling his friends and they were telling him/ he was telling them how terrible I was - it showed me that he actually did have other relationships, he did have other options for support. pouring all of that darkness and trauma and suicidal ideation into me was a choice.

Why was that choice made? I don't know. But it wasn't just a lack of support or lack of control. It was, I think, about conditioning me to accept a particular role in the relationship as his externalised emotional regulation. And indeed, he continued to blame me for his mental state and to target his spiralling and suicidality at me for the duration of the relationship.

My situation was similar in some ways. When I first met uBPDx, he was very mentally ill, but also in a situation re finances, immigration etc which would tend to make anyone unstable. It made sense that providing him with a high level of personal support for a period might be what he needed to break out it. That said, over time, I found that offering him what he said he needed - a break from paying rent by crashing with me, some space from a difficult interpersonal situation, the change to take a holiday - didn't make things any better.

The dependence on me increased over time, as did the anger and blame when I didn't meet all his needs. He was also resistant to seeking alternative avenues of support. For example, I sat with him for some hours to help with the admin process of getting access to healthcare, and when he got it, he never bothered to use it. He read and talked about psychoanalysis in an academic context - psychoanalysis for other people - but never even Googled BPD despite agreeing with me that he met the DSM criteria.

Maybe a lesson we can take from this - it's not wrong to help a person in crisis. But if the crisis never ends, and if the crisis-haver does not take reasonable responsibility for their own health, not seem to understand or take into account our own needs - it's not our obligation to empty ourselves out trying to please them. It's not even going to solve the crisis.


NotWendy, this is a great metaphor.


Pook, I am not in the US, but here as over there emergency services are very ill equipped to deal with mental health crisis and can often be quite harmful. I would not call the 911 equivalent unless it was a truly extreme situation. That said, if uBPDx were to get in my face and tell me he was thinking of hurting himself, today, I would take him to the emergency room, explain the situation, and leave him there. If he refused to go with me, then I would leave him on his own. I wish I had done this at the time.