Hi Brighterdays,

After reading your post, I can see that you are yearning for brighter days ahead, but that your mom is keeping you tethered to her backward-looking, negative narrative.  I think you are probably the bright one in the family, in part because of your dad, who tried to do what was best for you in a tough situation.  In turn, you've tried to keep everyone in the family happy, even if it meant parentification at a very young age.  I also get the feeling that you're very bright, in the sense that you're smart and can see what's really going on.  You've nailed how your mom relies on you to be her emotional caretaker.  But even if, intellectually, you see what's going on, you're conflicted about how to prevent your mother from dragging you (and your new family) down to her level.  You probably yearn to have a "normal" mother-daughter relationship, but your mother just isn't able to handle that, not when you were a kid, not now, and probably not in the future, for as long as she's clinging to the woe-is-me victim narrative, the stuck-in-the-past divorcee who refuses to face reality, take responsibility, move on and make a nice life for herself.  Even so, you feel guilty whenever you don't do your mother's bidding.  Does that sound about right?

I think that by now, you've seen that no matter how much you walk on eggshells around your mother and mollycoddle her feelings, she's still going to act needy, throw tantrums and believe falsehoods.  When she does this, it could be to get attention, to get you to over-function for her, or just to unleash her pent-up anger/frustration/jealousy/loneliness.  It's no surprise to me that she's acting up right now, precisely when you have some good news (and added stress) in your life:  an engagement and plan to start a family.  On the one hand, she's probably straight-up jealous of you, your happy news and your accomplishments.  On the other hand, she's jealous of your fiance, because much of your attention will be redirected towards him, and away from her.  I think you've seen through your mother already and understand that this is the problem du jour.  As you might know, the fear of abandonment is core to pwBPD, and your mom probably thinks she will be "losing" you to somebody else.  Cue the breakdowns, the feigned illnesses, the plaintive calls at all hours of the day and night, the desperate neediness, the blaming of others for ruining her life, the constant "testing" of your "loyalty" to her.  The second you start to pull away, she amps up her behavior, in the hopes that you will relent, only to get her to stop.

But here's the thing.  No matter what you do, your mom will still be upset, and she'll still have her unresolved issues.  Just look at the past decade or two:  her dysfunction/despair/lashing out/convoluted narrative have been pervasive, systemic, unrelenting, because she hasn't gotten treatment for BPD, or she hasn't taken treatment seriously.  In other words, no matter what you do, it will make no lasting difference to her behavior.  That's because you didn't cause BPD, you can't control it, and you can't cure it, no matter how much you want to.  Only your mom can do that.

So where does that leave you?  You could try to do whatever your mom asks, in a vain attempt to make her feel better.  But if you sacrifice your health, your life, your finances, your upcoming marriage and your other relationships, your mom will have succeeded in ruining your life, right along with hers.  I beg you not to let her do that.  You deserve to have a wonderful life!  And you are responsible for making that happen.  If your mom were of a right mind, that's what she'd want for you too.  So I think you honor your mom by making your life wonderful, OK?

What you can do is erect some boundaries.  Like ForeverDad states, boundaries don't change your mother's behavior; they focus on YOU and dictate YOUR behavior.  Maybe you could focus on one or two of your biggest issues right now.  One might be that your mom is calling you at all hours of the day and night, consuming too much of your time and emotional energy, when you need to work and get your rest.  Your boundary might be, all calls from mom go directly to voicemail.  You check your messages/texts from her once a day, when it's convenient for you.  If any message requires an actual response from you, then you will call your mom on your drive home from work, talk with her for 10 minutes, and hang up when you arrive home.  But if your mom starts shouting or criticizing, you will hang up immediately.  Maybe another issue is that your mom brings up the topic of your dad or the divorce, which stresses you out.  Your boundary might be that when your mom talks about your dad or divorce, you give one warning:  "Mom, talking about dad/divorce stresses me out; if you continue I'm hanging up/leaving."  And if she continues, you hang up or leave.

But maybe your mom's behavior is so toxic right now that you can't stand it anymore.  If that's the case, I'd say, you go ahead and take a break right now, because you need it.  You're no good to your mom if you're a basket case anyway.  You don't have to announce this strategy; just take a break--don't call, don't answer texts if that distresses you, don't visit in person, whatever.  You decide if you go Low Contact or No Contact, and you decide how long you need to take a break.  There's no clock on this.  I'd say, give it a try and see how you feel.  You just get busy with your life--planning for your marriage, seeing your friends, whatever.  You're young, you're supposed to be busy, and you're supposed to be prioritizing making an independent life for yourself.  That should be your focus, not caretaking your mom's emotions, OK?

Today my estranged daughter came and picked up the rest of her belongings. It’s exactly three months and 19 days since she first left. Today makes two weeks that my mother died. I lost my mother,  a young woman who I thought was my daughter and my grandchild all in under three and a half months. To say I am depressed is an understatement. I don’t know how to remake my life from here.

When I first learned of the pervasive impact of BPD (shortly before I arrived here in 2006) I recall that it was known as a Blamers disorder.  That's what you've experienced, Denial, Blaming, Blame Shifting, Projection, etc.  The problem is that trying to use logical approaches (JADE = Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain) will fail against the aggressive negativity of a person steeped in emotional perceptions rather than facts.

I went through a two year divorce where I had to record my interactions for self-protection, even at exchanges, just to document I wasn't the one posing aggressively as the victim.  You just can't make this up, it's that unbelievable.

Frankly, unless your mother starts and sticks long term with intensive therapy (DBT - Dialectical Behavioral Therapy is most helpful) and diligently applies it in her life, then she's unlikely to improve her aggressive blaming and behavior negativity.  Accept that.

So, what to do since she won't accept reasonable behavior boundaries?  Around here we recommend that effective Boundaries are for us.  Think about that for a moment since it's not intuitive.  Our Boundaries are our response to poor behavior.  Consider a bare bones framework such as "If you do or don't do ___ then I will in response do or not do ___."  It's not an ultimatum strictly speaking but simply what you will do in such scenarios.
Link to directory of our topics at Tools and Skills Workshops board

For example, if she starts blaming or is otherwise overly negative, then you - in response - are justified to say you're going to hang up, end the texting or leave and not return until she has had time to calm down or reset.  Then do that every time it happens, ad nauseum.

Be aware that likely this new boundary will trigger extinction burst(s) where she aims to wear you down until you go back to prior failed patterns.  Whether she eventually accepts your new smarter boundaries, only time will tell.  The point is that you set limits to your contact with her, since there is no other choice to not negatively impact your own health or that of your future family.

And good for you for seeking a local experienced counselor or therapist who knows how damaging people with BPD traits (pwBPD) can be.

Hello (a lot to unpack here sorry if this is scattered there is a lot), 2 decades ago my parents finalized a divorce in which my dad received custody my sister and I. Parents first separated when I was 3, custody battle finalized when I was 11. It was a grueling time for all of us. My mom didn’t live close, and would often start fights about how we didn’t see her enough - as if that was my responsibility as a child. My dad dropped us off to religious facilities she stayed at without a vehicle, on holidays although we didn’t like going there, and drove us 2.5 hours halfway (more than) whenever we wanted to go, which wasn’t overly frequent but he did not want to force us to do anything. He always supported our relationship with our mom and was there to help when she would lash out at us and we didn’t understand - but he always responded with kindness and tried to help us understand BPD and how to navigate it. I have had seasons of having to completely cut off my mom, and my sister has at this point had more no contact than contact. Essentially I was always the last one standing with my mom for most of her life. I am reaching another breaking point now.

Throughout the years I have been blamed for our lack of closeness, like I initiated a divorce, or even had a car at 11. She has spent decades trying to convince me that I was a victim of parental alienation, but I wasn’t. I am not sure after having so little contact while she was off finding herself, getting married multiple times and moving throughout the country where she came to this conclusion. She has not been able to move past the divorce and that has been the major stress in our relationship. It’s ironic because it’s almost like she’s trying to brainwash me into admitting I was brought up brainwashed about her, but it has been her own actions and words that have caused the strain. My sister and I are so gentile with her, we don’t bring up all of the trauma she has caused us and will only use examples lightly when we are defending ourselves or our loved ones from the blame she puts on us and then for missing the formative years of our lives. She does not listen to anything we say and refuses any accountability aside from an occasional moment of clarity or perhaps just pretending she believes our POV because she is bored of fighting.

I have reconnected with her in adulthood with more effort, and things were better, with semi frequent bumps in the road. It’s pretty typical parentified child relationship, she relies on me heavily for emotional regulation which can be a lot, but I sensed she was trying which made my hopeful. Nonetheless, there is always some other drama or anger towards the past, but she was happy with me. She then began to target my fiance, who is amazing and kind, but not used to walking on eggshells because he didn’t grow up with this specific relationship, pain and trauma. I am highly emotional and empathetic, and I don’t like confrontation -  and I feel like it would be constant if I didn’t pick and choose my battles. But this has affected my life in so many way, and I am at a loss because I am constantly stonewalled and can’t even share my own person lived experiences and perspectives without being stonewalled. There is so much to this I’m not even sure where to begin or end so I will get to my main questions.

I fear my mom sees my fiance as a threat since I believe she is so dependent on me, my time - and my emotional support for her. But even 3 days where I take a break and try to slow down the contact when we talk she is “more down then ever”. I never have time to myself to decompress without worrying about her. Has anyone found a sweet spot for regular but safe amount of contact- and if so, how did you set that boundary?

Does anyone have experience with bpd and divorce/ claims of parental alienation and choosing to not cope with the past?

Has anyone experienced a BPD parent trying to rewrite their own reality that they weren’t even present for?

Does anyone have advice on how to cope with upholding boundaries and personal healing while feeling like your parents life is in your hands? I can’t heal if I am always putting her emotions first.

I am battling so much pent up grief, guilt - and I know it is not my burden but I constantly feel bad my mom has no one left, but I am concerned for my marriage and my future and my future children - but I can’t keep this one boundary - please don’t discuss the divorce we have different experiences.

I think the hardest thing to grasp is that if I, her child, was truly brainwashed by my dad and stepmom into “hating her”, which I don’t, I love her very much, what would that even accomplish? Wouldn’t someone just feel bad their kids were brainwashed and not make them relive it constantly? I’m not sure what she is trying to accomplish by this, but it is really upsetting but nothing I say or do gets through to her. All I want is for my mom to move forward and have a better life, but this divorce and anger has consumed her and it’s hard to constantly (I haven’t gone 1 month when in contact with her without having to discuss her anger) relive a traumatic time in my life to help her cope, as much as I feel ready to move forward and I have forgiven a lot, it was a painful time in my life and I lost a chunk of my childhood to this. Why re-traumatize me about it for decades? And when I bring that up (not having my mom present was hard for me and this is a traumatic topic) she has no empathy of being the child in the scenario. Totally dismissive like no- it’s not as bad being the kid - she had it much much worse. Any advice helps. I can’t continue to pour every last drop of myself into trying to help her heal with 0 progress. Looking to begin therapy soon with a specialist, so I am hopeful for that.

This has been my biggest struggle as well, that people are so easily fooled despite what's right in front of them.  I get it, they want to think the best of my ex, but when her manipulation cycles are so obvious and toxic yet nobody seems to understand what's happening or how they're being played.  The ones that bother me most are our daughters, who fall for their mom's manipulation time and time again.

What I've learned though is my own personal mantra...this is only for right now.  I can't convince anyone of anything and I've stopped trying; I'll simply say that if they ever want to talk about their mom, I'll happily listen and share what I know.  They have to figure it out for themselves though and actually accept the reality that their mom's world revolves around her every need in the moment and never anyone else's.

To be clear, my ex is not a drug addict or an alcoholic, so I can't imagine what that must be like or how much more difficult that would be.  The manipulations are the same though and everyone believes it because she's such a sweet, kind, considerate person.  I try not to think about it because it makes me sick to my stomach, LOL.

I hope by now you and your son have learned that you can't loan her any more cars.  Nor do any errands for her, regardless how she appears in public.

I suspect that her appearing seeking for son to fetch her drugs was her attempt, perhaps subconscious, to ruin his happy birth event.  He needs to beware of the times she might appear in the future, scrutinizing "why?" and "why now? what's the trigger?"  In cases like ours, maintaining distance is usually a protection.

Yes, exactly. I wanted this young woman to experience success with me, rather than a negative because, success builds on success (hopefully- who knows). I also wondered what would have happened if my BPD mother had a different experience, and she wasn't going to learn a career at her elderly age and so wondered it it would make a difference for this person. I don't really know the outcome later. I decided to give it a try.

It's a pipe dream but I wish we saw BPD in the same way we see other conditions that lead to support in school and workforce, if it were possible. It would take some advocating. By early adulthood, pwBPD already have the emotional results of the disfunction that impeded their success. I don't know if it would make a difference but I have wondered.

Indeed, I think pwBPD have a very negative internal dialogue most of the time.

If I were running late for a session, my thought pattern would probably go something like this:  I'll message ahead that I'm running late, and maybe offer to reschedule if it's inconvenient for them to start late.  Since it's rare that I'm late and I'm making an effort to communicate, they'll understand.  Little setbacks happen from time to time, especially for busy executives like me, but this isn't a big deal to worry about.  I'll apologize, rework the schedule and move on.  Now that I think about it, there are a few coping tactics going on here:  contextualizing, empathy, communication, apologizing and trouble-shooting.  In addition, I'm confident of my general professional reputation, and I won't be derailed by a minor scheduling incident.

But for pwBPD, the internal dialogue is negative, emotionally-charged and often overwhelming.  She wouldn't think to call ahead when she knew she was running late, because it would be too scary.  She wouldn't have prepared the evening before, to ensure that she had all her logistics lined up, including meeting participant contact details and setting reminder alarms if necessary.  She's so overwhelmed by the prospect of being late that she works herself into a mess, and when she finally arrives at the meeting, she can barely concentrate on what she's supposed to be doing.  She sees that she has annoyed the other person in the meeting, but she probably forgets to apologize, or she comes up with a super-long story, blaming traffic and her own stupidity, drawing more negative attention to herself and delaying the meeting further.  Her colleague, who just wants to get her work done, probably feels further annoyed, and the entire encounter feels more stressful that it should be.  The pwBPD picks up on that, and she devolves into a deeper mess.  She internalizes and takes everything personally:  I'm a joke, a fraud, I can't do this.  Then the paranoia sets in:  my colleage thinks I'm a joke, a fraud, that I can't do this.  Then she catastrophizes:  I'm going to get fired.  Sometimes I think there might be some self-sabotage in all this:  she works herself into a tizzy, and she can't focus on her job because she's convinced herself that she can't do it, and that her colleagues hate her!  Her general coping tactic is avoidance:  avoiding owning up to her mistake, avoiding calling ahead to say she's running late, avoiding a simple apology, avoiding fixing the problem at hand, avoiding the task altogether because it's too hard/scary/stressful, wasting her valuable work time on non-problems that can't be changed after the fact.  She doesn't have the emotional maturity to learn from her mistake either:  she has to plan to arrive early to meetings, and extra-extra-early to important ones.  Instead, her worst fears might become reality, when she gets fired for low productivity/efficiency, or she beats them to the punch and quits.

I think there's an additional layer to being in student mode while the expectations are higher. The emotional regulation issues are still there.

The person I worked with could do well at times but one time she was late for a session with someone else and by the time she came to me she was crying because that person showed annoyance, she was declaring that person hates her, (they didn't hate her)  and so on. She was so upset, that she wasn't able to focus, so I sent her home with plans to try later.

Someone who didn't "get it" would have no understanding of this and actually it wasn't in my job description either but that she was placed with me, and knowing she had BPD made the difference for both of us.

I don't know what happened with her after our sessions together. I hope your daughter can pull it together. I hope this young woman can too. Perhaps she felt safe enough to be open with her emotions with me, or will do it in other settings as well.

I agree it is confusing to see someone so smart and capable also struggle emotionally. Your D may need extra encouragement from her father and you,  and so hopefully this will work out well for her.

Indeed that sums up the current situation pretty well.  On the professional front, my stepdaugher needs lots and lots of patient training, reassurance, praise, guidance and hand-holding.  Alas, I think she skipped some years of lower-stakes, slower-paced internships, and so she lacks practice in basic job survival skills:  arriving early and prepared, taking careful notes, knowing how to focus, knowing how to receive coaching/corrections/feedback, prioritizing, clear communication, double-checking work, staying positive/enthusiastic, pitching in, being generally helpful, and sometimes, working late to catch up if needed.  I think one of her big issues is that she's older now, and so her employer expects her to be more advanced than she really is.  Part of the issue could relate to my stepdaughter's overselling of her prior work accomplishments, but hey, her current job isn't a highly skilled one and wouldn't require a college degree.  Yet I think intellectually, she's still in "student" mode, i.e. expecting to be taught and shown everything, sometimes multiple times, rather than to be more autonomous and figure out some things by herself.  She complained that a colleague stated, "You should be getting this by now."  Emotionally, she's still probably at a teen's level, getting too upset over constructive criticism, having trouble enduring a fast pace for eight hours a day, and constantly doubting herself, which is interfering with her ability to stay on task.  I mean, where is she getting the time to call up her relative in the middle of the workday to vent about all the work she has to get done?

As for Pook's point about his daughter's sudden desire to reconnect when moving geographically close to her again . . . that has happened to me too.  However, in my situation, the sudden interest in reconnection and visitation feels much more like a scouting trip to me, in line with the "needs-based" and "transactional" nature of our relationship most of the time.  In other words, visiting and reconnecting feels like my pwBPD is scoping out future living quarters, staking claims to "her" room, confirming a free storage facility, and confirming that the parental cash flow is still ample and able to be channeled her way.  She wants a key to my home, she wants the code to the garage, and she wants to know when we're on vacation.  I think it's part of her "entitled" view that my house is her house.  The second we leave on vacation, she's going to crash and "play house" in my home (even though she has her own apartment), but she's not going to inform us, let alone ask permission.  With a "normal" and responsible person, I wouldn't mind it so much, but with her, it just always feels like I'm providing free hotel / storage / laundry / pantry service, but with no hotel fees, reservations or contributions with general upkeep, let alone replacing the things she consumes, let alone attending to basic home care like taking out her trash.  I dislike the entitlement and general sneakiness, too. 

Her siblings will visit and live with us from time to time, but their visits don't feel transactional.  Even if they don't help out with any home chores, they are generally respectful (especially my stepson) and fun to be around.  I'm just saying this because I don't think this is a "me" issue as much as a BPD one.

Anyway, another work week has commenced.  I'm keeping my fingers crossed.  I've told my husband, it's normal to feel stressed out about a new job.  What's not normal is to quit on the spot without having another job lined up first.  Alas, my stepdaughter has quit numerous jobs in the first few days.  My hope is that she can hang on for three months.  I told myself I'd be impressed if she could last that long.  Even if she does quit or get fired, I'd see it as a step in the right direction, because it's her first full-time job that she selected for herself all by herself.  She can learn a lot from it.  At the very least, she can add it to her resume.

Pook, welcome home.  The paperwork will get done, all you need is patience and persistence, as I'm sure you already know.