Hello, friends!  I knew it was inevitable I would be back in THIS part of the club!  My granddaughters' mom (I have drawn 2 unlucky straws with 2 BPD family members!) says I can only see the kids once a month because I said I would no pick up one of the kids an hour away from my house, because the child's FATHER did not feel like driving her home on his weekend (I would add, I have done this twice, but, my car needs a "rotor" which my husband is fixing tomorrow, so...she is "tired of my excuses", sigh....what a cruddy club
 

I apologize if my reply came off that way- I wouldn't listen to anyone bad-mouth my daughter.  What I meant was, if your sister wants to "cry victim" then let her cry.  Her complaints are about how she feels and not necessarily what happened, which you likely know from all the other relative interactions that were damaged.  

I would rather someone come to me, especially with my understanding of mental illness, than have them confront my daughter who's likely to tell that person off and make things considerably worse.  That's just my opinion though.

I must have assumed you were the father since my BPD mother had issues with my father's sister.

It may be significant that you are female. My BPD mother seemed to project more and have friction with female family members. I think it may be because females are more similar, and so a pwBPD may project their own feelings about self image on to someone with more similarities. They may also feel a sense of competition or comparison with other females more than male. (their own feelings- not that other females are actually competing with them).

My BPD mother would say things about the other female relatives as if somehow they had something "wrong". Perhaps this felt validating to her? I don't know if your sister has her own family but perhaps, by finding fault with your D, and therefore you and your family, it somehow feels more validating to her if she's having relationship issues.

Whatever your sister's reasons, you don't have to participate in or validate her misperceptions but also trying to JADE - argue that she's wrong may just add to the drama. We can't change someone else's thinking but we can choose to not add emotion to it- and just grey rock, change subject, disengage, if she brings it up.

In my situation, BPD mother didn't believe there was anything "wrong" with her but could believe that her kids needed therapists- ie- the issues were because of us, not her, or in your case your daughters' issues are because of you, but not her.

BPD mother was pro-therapy in general. One reason I think it didn't work with her was due to the denial/projection associated with BPD. BPD mother did have therapy- but (as far as I know) the sessions were about her talking about other family members being problematic to her, not about her own issues.

This doesn't mean all pwBPD are resistant to therapy. I know some younger people who have BPD and are going to therapy for it, and aren't denying it, but BPD is on a spectrum and so this willingness to work with a therapist probably varies. If your wife is resistant to it, then she is.

I have worked with therapists off and on over time. It hasn't been a continuous need, but more circumstantial, like starting college, and some family issues along the way.

I also have seen that the quality and effectiveness of therapists have varied but overall, it's been helpful to have someone objective to talk to. The goal for your daughters may not be  a "one and done"- as if a therapist is going to help them with the issues of having a BPD mother and then they won't need more. It may be more of an "as needed" at some times. The relationship with their mother is an evolving one, with typical milestones along the way that they may want emotional support with. (leaving home, maybe getting married, maybe having children).

A therapist can validate feelings and perspective, be a safe person to talk to. It helps if they know about BPD but I don't think it's a necessity- because if your daughters don't have BPD- their needs are specific to them- if they have anxiety, or fears, or need someone to validate their feelings and perspectives. What may be more important is the "fit" and if there's progress. If your older D doesn't feel a good fit with her current one, then she should seek one that is better for her. As a parent- you can make suggestions but she needs to decide.  For your younger D, if she's content with the one she has, then consider it's better to not have so many changes at one time. Your marriage may change, she may go off to college, so having the ongoing relationship with her T is one constant for her.

It would be great if there were more common sense in business as to how to handle employees better, but more often than not you are told to suck it up and be professional. In some cases they even go as far as that you have to act like you get along and are friends...I'm not kidding as I had to deal with that nonsense before myself.

I hope for your sake everything goes in your favor.

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

Hey Barney, welcome to the fam 

So to kind of backup my sensei Skip here, but in more direct blunt terms...what kind of help and advice do you seek? Do you want advice and support on how to end the relationship and detach or do you want advice and support on how to better the relationship and find a way to make things work?

You are the driver, the captain of the ship. Tell us which route you would like to go.

We look forward to helping you through your journey and ordeal. Hang in there.

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

One other quick thing re therapy. 

My wife tends to eschew it for herself but has not resisted it for the girls and younger daughter has a pretty good working relationship with a therapist in SG who works with children and young adults. Said therapist has been really helpful laying down parenting ground rules over the last couple of years and also coming up with a really detailed set of grounds rules for keeping things calm during April, when my daughter has exam prep and exams. 
]
]I also have a therapist I'm pretty happy with. (18 months ago I stopped working with a therapist who I have worked with and who has done couples work AND worked with my wife on and off over more than 15 years. He crossed a bunch of lines in a way that really set us back....)

But no-one so far seems to know a lot about BPD etc. or to be able to provide some of the guidance you all have already provided. Should I try to find someone to work with with more expertise? Or to find someone for one or both daughters with that expertise?  Older daughter in Toronto has struggled to find someone good and in fact is currently looking for a new therapist.

So much here, again. Thank you! 

First, a technical question. How do insert quotes as you all seem to know how to? This is a nice feature for responding to people's specific questions and comments.

In any event, really leaning in to comments by Pook070 and others, I've had a further discussion with my wife, emphasizing emotion and relationships and feel like I may be getting somewhere. Her extreme position is to say that if I don't give her everything she wants, she will fight to delay the divorce until 2029/30, the first date I could divorce without legal grounds. I've encouraged her to think about the benefits to her of getting divorced sooner and asked her to let me know what "sweeteners" might help her to agree to an earlier divorce date. (Honestly, I'm not wedded to a 2026 divorce; I just want to get off the emotional rollercoaster involved with living with her and funding her relationship).  I talked a lot about the importance of starting to repair relationships with the girls; that in particular seems to have resonated. She is going to think about terms and get back to me. 

Don't know if this is real progress but I do think the different language and approach is better -- we shall see. Thank you for that. More later.

Some of our best qualities are our sense of fairness and niceness.  However, those same qualities can set us up for self-sabotage.  How so?

If we try to be super fair or overly nice it may open the door for our stbEx (soon-to-be-ex) to demand more when working on terms for the divorce.  While a normal person would appreciate consideration and respect, that seldom is a positive factor in an acting-out PD divorce.

Also, don't expect the court to grant you points in your favor if you are overly generous in offers to your ex.  Court allows a lot of bickering, drama and posturing in the courtroom.  Then it just proceeds to the next step.

Your spouse may be allowed far too much leniency what obstructing progress with minimal consequences.  Yet you can be ever so polite and agreeable yet get no credit no matter how nice or generous your are.

Keep in mind your first offers, however 'fair', will be met with demands for more.  So it may be wise to hold some things in reserve - "cards up your sleeve", so to speak - for use later.

Many here have pondered how to be strategic and plan ahead, sensing beforehand what is likely more motivating to the stbEx.  For example, you likely have your daughters' futures in mind, so when negotiating also seek your daughters' welfare so they too have a better outcome.

So helpful. Thank you.