I don't have spiraling conversations.  If I see it's going that route, I'll tell my BPD that I love her and I'm stepping away before either of us gets angry.  Not that I'm getting angry, but it's easier to say "we" than "you" to someone unstable.  Then I step away for a bit and pick up the conversation when things are calmer.


Your sister is mentally ill.  You claim that you're not and I believe you.  That means when things start to go sideways, it's up to the sane person in the room to not "take the bait" and get into an argument.  If my BPD wants to argue, I literally just walk away...and I'll try to tell them that I love them and I don't want to argue. 

But if that doesn't work, then I just walk away (or hang up the phone, whatever).


Boundaries are for you and only you can enforce boundaries.  It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks or how they react to your boundaries; it's up to you each time to use them in a predictable way.

For instance, if I tell you that I won't speak to you if you say the word 'banana,' yet you say it to me three times fast mocking me.  I can't stop you and I shouldn't argue over what you decide to do- that's not the boundary part.  Instead, the boundary determines what I'll do if you don't respect what I'm asking you to do...so I walk away.

Now, if you make a boundary with your sister that you won't talk to her if she's arguing, then she's probably argue even more.  That brings us to the previous questions you asked, you simply stick to your boundaries and exit the conversation.  You can do that in a loving way though and it makes you very predictable- if she yells, you're retreating.

The way I explain it to my BPD is that my boundaries are for me, and she can decide to respect them or not.  I make it very well known though:
- If you yell at me, I'm leaving so everyone can calm down. 
- If you hit me (or anyone else) I'm dialing 9-1-1. 
- If you leave my house a mess, you're not welcome to stay here.

Here's the thing though; your sister is making all the decisions.  If she's nice, you talk things out.  If she's mean, you leave.  If she's violent, you call the cops.  Every action you take follows a very obvious set of rules that she knows about.  So it's not you doing this or that, it's her deciding what you'll do next. 

Every decision is ultimately hers; you're giving her all the power and just reacting accordingly.

My BPD daughter is a few years older than yours, and she's had numerous medical problems a girl in her 20"s shouldn't have to deal with.  Last year they removed her uterus due to extensive cysts on the ovaries, etc.  She's also had bad stomach problems throughout he late teens until now (she's 26).

Could there be a connection?  I'm not sure.  He younger sister or her mom hasn't had any of these issues, and there's no history on my side either.  It has always seemed very strange to me though and I wondered if there's a connection we wouldn't think about.

Frankly, I've stopped trying to deal with fundamental relationship issues with sib with BPD.  I protect my time.  I stop contact until yelling stops.  I validate when I can.  Things are much calmer and that's a miracle, so, it's not ideal, but it's enough.

This isn't about what you did and honestly, it's not about what she did either.  This is about a broken relationship with a broken young woman who can't process her feelings.

I don't fully understand- why do you have anxiety going on campus?  Is it the fear of seeing her?

Here's the thing- everything you've said, everything that bothers you, is her opinions.  But like others have said over and over, she's mentally ill and processes thoughts differently.  When she's stressed, she says whatever she feels in the moment, and she might not believe what she said 10 seconds ago.  She just said it to make herself feel better because she's mentally unstable.

For instance, I was hanging shelves the other day and dropped a hammer on my toes.  It hurt like mad and I said, "I hate this <beep beep> hammer!"  I normally don't cuss at all...but came right out of my mouth.

So I'll ask the question- do you think I actually hate my hammer?  Or did my emotions just get the better of me in the moment?

Your ex experiences life the same way, only metaphorical hammers are falling on her multiple times per day.  And when she gets in a disordered state, her thoughts and actions are all over the place as she tries to make sense of what's happening to her.  As you've said, she has self-reflected because this has happened multiple times.  But her conclusion that it's everyone's fault....it can't be just her!

The easy answer is that it's mental illness and she's sick.  Don't let her warped opinion of you change who you actually are.

Good to hear!!

For the past 3-4 months, my 23-year-old DD had been throwing up a lot, and occasionally complaining about nausea and stomach pains. At first, we chalked it up to eating some bad food, then she took a pregnancy test, and then we just thought it would go away. Finally, she was referred to a gastroenterologist who ordered bloodwork, an upper endoscopy, and a stomach biopsy to rule out ulcers or gall bladder issues. Both were negative. But several liver function tests came back abnormal. The next test was a FibroScan of her liver, which showed a significant scarring of her liver. She has now been scheduled for a liver biopsy and some more specialized bloodwork specifically for the liver.

She is not a drinker, and she does not have hepatitis. My husband and I strongly suspect this is a result of all the mood stabilizers, etc., she has taken since she was very young. She hasn't had the biopsy yet, but her doctor told her that from the FibroScan, she was surprised to see that much scarring in someone her age.

Of course, we are very worried. Has anyone else experienced this with their pwBPD?

I don't know what the point of the phone call was, but again, you're trying to understand the workings of a disordered mind!  It doesn't matter what the point of the phone call was.  She probably doesn't even know what the point of the phone call was. You were really just providing some human contact to fill the void in her existence for a moment.  She moved on and probably doesn't even think about it. 

You didn't do anything wrong.  If she is BPD, the problem is entirely in her head.  Don't take the things she says at face value; she can find fault with every man on the planet no matter how wonderful they are and how well they treat her.  Certainly don't allow her behavior to change how you think about yourself, anymore than you would take the judgment of a toddler seriously. 


When BPDxw would pick huge fights that would linger on for weeks, she would usually demand I take some accountability for it, regardless of the fact that she would create the conflict out of whole cloth, and escalate and behave like a moron over nothing. 

I think they do this for a couple reasons: 1) taking some accountability for their actions gradually allows them to avoid all accountability.  After all they only acted like that because you did something... make them feel insecure, or roll your eyes, or sigh, or look aggressive, or whatever nonsense they come up with; and 2) they can gradually force you to accept things over time that you never would up front, by a series of compromises against yourself. 


You see she'll always find a way to make it about her; pwBPD's are outrageously self-centered, and their emotional issues take precedent over everything else in their life.  If you truly are concerned about your academics, she'll find a way to make you more concerned about whether your academic goals make her feel insecure about her own mediocrity; she'll drag you down to her level, and then keep dragging you down. 

What your mother thinks is a nice Christmas sounds like a nightmare. This reminds me of an email my father sent me when I began having boundaries with BPD mother ( and she wasn't pleased). "I just want us to be a happy family again" -which I think meant appeasing mother and not having boundaries. (my parents seemed to have a similar relationship as yours).

I also get not wanting our parents to be unhappy with our decisions, especially in their elder years. Holidays are stressful in general and so BPD behaviors did increase during these times. My BPD mother often didn't do much for holidays but when she did, it was similar- her dysreguating if something wasn't done perfectly. If my mother did entertain guests, it had to be perfect.

I wonder if by having Christmas be spectacular- that one day somehow makes up for the rest of the behaviors? That's just a guess but for one day, the family appears picture perfect to her?

Holiday celebrations may change as the family grows. Sometimes the kids go to the in laws. Travel gets more complicated with small children. Young families want to have their own traditions. I can understand feeling sad over these changes but I think it's an adjustment many families make over time.

Unfortunately, it seems as if your mother will react to the changes and be upset. One aspect of her celebration is being the one who is the center, that she achieves a noteworthy celebration and feels affirmed by it. One idea is to send her a nice gift- but with the exception would she throw it away or destroy it out of anger. My BPD mother would do that. The gift I chose to send was flowers- she usually liked that. So it's something you might want to do to still make her feel appreciated on this day.

Hi!  My response is going to sound non-chalant, only because it has been almost 3 solid years of minimal contact....my 24 (must be the AGE?) daughter, pwBPD was diagnosed with BPD about 4 years ago, the first year, I researched EVERYthing, read all the books, joined NAMI, I slept over my daughter's apartment at least 3x a week, (so many sad stories, she would have me take her pills, so she did not OD, hide her knives, there were 2 inpatient psych stays, she would tell me to shut the F up out of the blue (gosh, just typing this is making me tear up) in any case, out of the clear blue, she told me I was the reason she was like "this" after demanding $5000 for her school loan (long story....I was paying her college tuition, out of pocket, during my overtime) but she dropped out & owed money....I did not have $5000 that MINUTE....she has since ceased contact with me, her father, her sister and her 3 young nieces (the oldest, we practically raised); she texts only if she needs money, etc.; I have mailed her holiday cards/gift cards, birthday cards (the first year of holidays, I cried all day long, Mother's day, my birthday, her birthday (I have a BPD specialist/therapist, so, I am attempting to find JOY again); she has moved (I only know this, because she is on my health and auto insurance) so....this year I cannot even do that (gosh....I am tearing up, again   all I can say, BPD is a BEAST; please free to reach out, if you like....I wish you good luck and am sincerely sorry you (and any in this group) are going through this

Hi, I related to your post, especially to the feeling of responsibility and feeling trapped.
I'm also the oldest and only daughter of a mother who I suspect has bpd - she fits the profile, and my dad fits the enabler profile perfectly.
Christmas was always a huge deal at our lavishly decorated home. There was a strict hierarchy of Christmas tree ornaments from 'good' to 'not so good' (the ones we kids made), and we knew exactly where they were supposed to be hung on the tree (homemade ones on the back, near the bottom). This unspoken rule was only obvious to me when a college boyfriend came to help decorate the tree - he was insulted that my Mom moved all the ornaments he placed to their 'correct' position - he told me he'd never heard of ranking ornaments! I thought it was perfectly sensible and everyone did it!
Every Christmas Eve there would be a breakdown: "No one in this family helps me do a thing!" "How did I get to have such lazy kids!" "Christmas is CANCELLED!!!" We would ask what to do and she'd yell "JUST HELP!"
I remember wising up in college and asking for specific instructions - that got vitriol thrown at me, too, but going forward, with my own kids, I try to be very specific about what I need help with, and to watch my stress levels - so much of learning about parenting for me has been 'what not to do'.
Strangely -- I don't need that much help! I have one less child than my Mom; also, my standards for food and decorations are not as high as hers!
I moved overseas in my early twenties. I was able to come back to the USA a few times for Christmas. My kids protected me from a lot of 'the wrath' and it's probably fair anyways to expect some stress and yelling when a family of five descends on your house for two weeks over the holidays - although babies were not welcome - the decorations were too breakable and "they have to learn "NO"- don't touch!"
I asked my parents to spend Christmas with us overseas a few times, but Mom explained, "Christmas means too much to me to spend anywhere else but in my own home."
Now my kids are also grown up, and I haven't been back to the USA for Christmas for over twenty years.
I have two brothers that live locally to my parents and have always spent Christmas with them. This year, one brother is taking a holiday with his family beginning Dec. 23, and the other brother has to work on Christmas Day.
My parents are in their late 80s and (relatively) hale and hearty but this is going to be hard for them -- of course, because of the rigid thinking of having to do things ON CHRISTMAS - not the week before, or after. There is incredible longevity in our family, so I'm not necessarily thinking, "This is their last Christmas!" but it does feel bold (?) of my brothers to make other plans for the first time ever. I am watching at a distance... my own kids are coming to our house for Christmas so I won't be flying to the US although it feels like I should.
Don't know exactly how this is a reply to the original post, just 'dread' and 'holidays' resonated with me... I have purposely tried to be flexible in celebrating the holidays, inviting different constellations of people, being guests some years, hosting others - my husband and I even spent Christmas on our own in another country one year! A lot of what I do is in reaction to what my Mom prizes  - unwavering tradition and rituals -
I'm waiting for the PLEASE READ to really hit the fan when her family Christmas does not resemble all the previous years'- my parens have many friends and relatives, they will be invited everywhere, but I feel scared about the inevitable crying phone call, "What did I do to deserve this, I only ever tried to make Christmas nice for you kids and this is how I'm repaid."