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How to communicate after a contentious divorce... Following a contentious divorce and custody battle, there are often high emotion and tensions between the parents. Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, their body language and their parents behavior. Here are some suggestions from Dean Stacer on how to avoid conflict.
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Author Topic: What were Your first warning signs  (Read 949 times)
daintrovert13
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« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2013, 09:07:36 PM »

me:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

Yessssss!
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dharmagems
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« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2013, 11:05:09 PM »

-He emailed me after our first blind date and I said I wasn't interested and he emailed me back "breaking up" with me and then I emailed wishing him well, and then he emailed me back saying he wants to meet me again

-He moved very fast, said "i love you" after 1 month of dating.  He discussed marriage and house buying after that and moved in after 2 months, and proposed after 2 months of dating

-Went into tantrums when we couldn't make appointments together like driving to make an appointment at the airport and we missed it and he went absoulutely raging blaming me in the car

-Raged at me when I made comments I was having doubts about our marriage

-He made insults about other people

-He would say I love you every 10 mins.

-He would hug me like a mother and say I was ok and I love you baby

-was an absolute momma's boy.  I went to visit his parents and he had a weird almost incestuous relationship with his mother.  His mother talked to him like he was still a baby and doted after him.  His only friends were his parents

-His only relationship was with a woman in his mid 20s and then with me.  He was 40 when he dated me.  He didn't date for 15 years.  He was a virgin at 40 when he met me

-Said he was a gaming addict before he met me and he still games

-Every time I wanted to hang with other friends, he made a comment for me to stay with him

-We went on a group hike and he followed me a step behind me, like an attached baby

-Said he was too good to date other women before me.  Other women weren't good enough for him

-Random road rage blaming the other drivers

-He would coddle me comb my hair and give me foot rubs

-was with me 24/7, very needy

-I called the police on him when he was raging and blaming me in the car and we were heading home

-When he proposed to me he rented an expensive hotel room to surprise me and then when he wanted to surprise me by asking me out that night, I said I didn't want to go out that evening, and he had a rage blowup saying "you ALWAYS mess things up... .  !"

This was only in the first 6 months I was with him.  The next 2.5 years later, it got worse, believe me.
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sadderbutwiser

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« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2013, 05:07:19 AM »

Here were my warning signs:

Told me of his 2 failed marriages, and failed long term relationship in great detail on our first date - demonising them with himself as victim.

Despite being an accountant - was in debt, lived in a rental that was frankly a filthy hovel, spent recklessly, had cashed in his pension, spent £130K of his £150K divorce settlement in one year with nothing material to show for it.

Drank heavily and daily - and lied about it to me.

Expected to move in with me - with his 2 youngest sons (4 and 6 yrs) for whom he had care for one night a week and 3 weekends - with no suggestion of what he would contribute.

Had only 2 "friends" - who were not what I would term friends

Older sons in their 20's - one hadn t talked to him for years - one only saw him when he wanted money.

Jealous- said he knew "every man at work "was waiting to go out with me - and jealous of my good relationship with my ex husband - when we were together with our kids on their birthdays etc.

Lies - boasting.

Couldn't be alone  - constantly phoning and texting me while I was at work, and in the evenings when I did not see him.

Extravagant gifts

Rages - getting worse in intensity over imagined neglect or slights

Had an over religious, critical and neglecting mother

Sulked, guilted,  criticised

Wated to be included on my nights out with my women friends - jealous of them
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sadderbutwiser

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« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2013, 05:16:24 AM »

(contd)

He declared his "feelings" on our 3 rd dats and bought me "I   you" charms for my silver bracelet - which made me uneasy

Told me also on 3rd date that his sister "was glad I had a good job and my own home".

Quickly dropped all his hobbies and arrangements to become totally involved in my life, with my friends, and with my family - took on a different identity.

I was surprised to find what common interests we had (later realised about"mirroring"

Said things - but actions did not match up (e.g. what I admired about him was that he said his time with his kids came first - but later on - he would ditch them if he thought he was missing out on something I was doing with my own family - even trying to take them back early on Fathers Day so he could come to my family celebration.

Finally - met someone on a blind date 4 weeks after we broke up - moved in with her 8 weeks later.
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Wimowe
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« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2013, 10:02:23 AM »

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) didn't show up at an event we planned to attend together -- never acknowledged much less apologized

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) alternated between bitter victimhood and self-recrimination

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) history of dubious, abusive, and/or long distance relationships

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) called me several times per day, every day

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) no job, living off of retirement savings unsustainably

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) moved in with me a few months after we began dating, without discussion

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) obsessed about events that had occurred years (>5) before

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) too often, when I started to share something about myself, she immediately changed the subject to her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) texted an xbf ("We're just friends" when we were in bed together

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) lots of (real) physical ailments requiring time consuming

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) reputation (in various organizations in which she participated) for being unreliable

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) told me several times that she had refused wealthy men who offered to support her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) sexually flirtatious; a lot of men seemed to have crushes on her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) at her therapist's request, she and the therapist took art classes together

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) wouldn't acknowledge to certain of her male friends that she and I were dating  ("We don't discuss our romantic activities"

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) I had brief moments of clarity where I could see that she wasn't capable of a truly reciprocal emotionally committed intimate relationship


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struggli
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« Reply #35 on: February 10, 2013, 12:19:49 PM »

-Gave me her number and after a lot of texting, I asked her out and she told me she had a boyfriend, but said we could be friends.  I said no because I was sexually attracted to her.

-Two weeks later, she calls me up.  I assume she is single now because of our previous conversation.  We go on a date.  She tells me she was raped within about 30 minutes.  It's slightly shocking, but I take it lightly.  

-After date, we go to my place and have sex.  :)on't get me wrong, I wanted to.

-We have sex everyday for about 4 or 5 days after first date.  She tells me then "I just broke up with ex."  Ummm, so she was having sex with me all that time and she was still technically in a relationship.

-She tells me she loves me in about a couple weeks (which isn't a red flag to me because I felt the same way about her), however a couple weeks later tells me "she's not good at love."  Silly me, I don't give that statement as much attention I should've. I just tell her she seems to be doing fine to me.

-I see her putting candy in her boss' mouth

-I meet her male friend (her first boyfriend) and they flirt:  he says "I know you want me", they giggle a lot, he slaps her but when she's walking in front of him, they play with each others hair... .   It's all very childlike, and probably harmless, but still pisses me off.  I tell her afterward that the whole thing was very uncomfortable for me.  She says "If you want me to give up my friends for you I will"  What do I say to this?  Yes, give up your friends?

-After three months together, I am going to be leaving town to see my family.  I had told her about it and invited her well in advance.  She said she would go.  At the last minute, she said she could not go because of having accepted a new job just a few days before.  Seems reasonable to me, so I'm bummed but I understand.  The day before I am to leave, she calls me by her ex's name, and I catch her texting him that she misses him.  Our first fight begins.  She then begs me not to leave and tells me she doesn't know how to be alone.  Things were never the same after I left that following day.  

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nowwhatz
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« Reply #36 on: February 10, 2013, 12:50:29 PM »

I didn't know anything about BPD at the time but on the first date I thought she was just plain crazy and depressed.

Initially I was not attracted to her because she was so crazy even though she was very hot.

But there was something 'special' about her which caused me to give her another chance. She seemed 'nice.'

On 'date' 3 there was this sudden super mutual attraction like you might see in movies or novels like a lightening bolt. Seemed to come out of nowhere.

Well... .  the warning signs were immediate and continue to this day (2 years on the 19th). There are too many to list... .  many are incredible and unbelievable... .  some downright hilarious... .  but I don't want to relive them.

The bottom line is it did not matter what the warning signs were/are.

The only thing that matters now is whether or not I will be able to resist the next recycle attempt.
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Seb
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« Reply #37 on: February 10, 2013, 01:02:51 PM »

I feel embarrassed to write mine because I look at them and cringe. Why oh why was I so stupid to get sucked in to this, and not run for the hills? This r/s has really exposed my inherent lack of self-worth. Ok... .  

• Very first time I met her... she came along to a sports day out. I was her mate's cousin. She got drunk, she put her hand down my top and inside my bra in public, and kept trying to kiss me, licking my neck and ear, and was groping me. Later on I was sleeping and she got on top of me and started to kiss me again, pulled down my top and started kissing my breasts until I pushed her off. I'd never met her, and I was 'straight'. Text me an apology for 'bad behaviour' a day later.

• Second time I met her put her hand up my skirt, again in public.

• Was terrified to come out (longest r/s was with ex-boyfriend of 3 years, every other girl has been a hook-up), so at 28 is still deeply closeted. Why did I think she would come out for me?

• Her type is 'straight'... .  short-term, no future. She told me she only liked straight girls, didn't find lesbians attractive.

• Ignored my cousin who told me she was bad news. Told her outright to stay away from me on my ex's birthday. She had no clue we were already "in love" at this point, but said to stay away from me. My ex had made it clear she fancied me, but that was all she knew. My cousin had known her for 8 years... I'd met her twice before we started dating.

• We had sex on our first date, even though I told her I was nervous/wanted to take it slowly because I'd never been with another girl.

• Told me she was "completely in love" with me after 3 weeks, but wanted to tell me sooner (she didn't even know me)

• Told me she was always meant to be unhappy and alone

• Told me she wasn't good at relationships and to get out whilst I still could, and she didn't want that life for me.

• Told me she felt wrong, abnormal and weird, and that she wasn't right for being gay.

• Displayed signs of shame during sex (covering face with pillow)

• Always sick... .  bad stomach/headache. Constantly taking something for them.

• Had no real friends. Always cried about being alone.

• Everyone had treated her badly... .  she was the victim of these r/s's that had hurt her deeply when they'd ended. These girls had broken her heart, used her, made a fool of her.

• Wanted me to move in with her after 5 weeks

• Talked about marriage after 8 weeks, it was a case of when she asked me to marry her.

• Told me she often thought about killing herself, but would never do it because of her mum.

• Told me how you felt when you died was how you felt forever - in relation to suicide, doing it when you felt happy.

• Picked fights with me all the time, especially if we were lying in bed after sex. I would get up to leave and she would have this terrified look on her face, and would be frantic for me not to leave and grab hold of me and pull me back, "Please don't leave! If you leave you'll never come back".

• Drank wine every night and took painkillers to sleep. Had night shakes/terrors. She would always suddenly jerk when she was about to drop off to sleep and wake herself up.

• Had slept with ten times as many people as I had.

• Invited the 'evil' ex she 'hated' to her birthday party and bought said ex a birthday gift and flirted with her all night in front of me and everyone.

• Extreme jealousy if I even looked at anyone else.

• Always reading my text messages.  

• Had a photo of an ex fling and her on her fridge for the duration of our r/s, and one framed stuffed in her wardrobe. Lied and gave another name when I first asked who that was in the photo.

• Put up a very inappropriate birthday card in her flat from the aforementioned ex fling, saying how turned on she was getting at the thought of my ex.

• Was dating a lesbian when we got together - I didn't check they were officially over, should have, I just assumed they were. This was a girl that my ex was set up with the night she first met me (and more or less sexually assaulted me!).

------- all of the above within 2 months of dating.

I've come to realise, that these sorts of feelings, whilst shocking to most, weren't alien to me. Most people would have seen a girl with major emotional issues and run the other way. I, on the other hand, recognised this, and was familiar with this, so jumped straight in. Our r/s only took hold because I was emotionally unhealthy too. Clearly I was to stay in this relationship. These red flags came after two months, and things only got worse... .  the lying, the constant contact with exes, the increasing emotional fragility and hypersensitivity. At one point I thought she was autistic because she couldn't read me, everything was very literal. Then the whole mothering came in, it became clear to me that she wanted me to re-parent her, to show her the unconditional love she never had.

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.
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bb12
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« Reply #38 on: February 10, 2013, 04:10:55 PM »

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.

Yep - that is the entire point of this experiece. To learn.

It is the slap in the face that wakes us up to feeling for the first time. We go from not knowing ourselves at all, to knowing ourselves backwards. An amazing reward for the intense pain... .  if we do the work and really seek to understand what happened

Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

bb12
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GreenMango
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« Reply #39 on: February 10, 2013, 04:34:30 PM »

It's really easy to talk about the red flags.  Another question to ask ourselves is why you stayed?
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TheDude
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« Reply #40 on: February 10, 2013, 04:36:24 PM »

It's really easy to talk about the red flags.  Another question to ask ourselves is why you stayed?

And another would be... .  why did I keep going back?
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GreenMango
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« Reply #41 on: February 10, 2013, 04:42:19 PM »

Also an excellent question... .  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

When I looked at that I had some really ugly feelings come up... .  that took awhile to work through. Smiling (click to insert in post)
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dharmagems
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« Reply #42 on: February 10, 2013, 06:21:57 PM »



And another would be... .  why did I keep going back?[/quote]
I am still healing from this whole experience in undertanding why I kept coming back... .  I believe all the attention he gave me was because I never experienced the loving treatment before.  I came from a domestically abusive upbringing and he was the first to care for me like a mother.  Give me bear hugs, say I love you, you're ok, give me foot rubs and body rubs, and open the door for me, give me flowers.  I have never gotten that before.  That's why I kept coming back.  BUT---there's the bigger understanding and healing, and ultimately I have to leave, and that is a blessing to me, and I am so proud that I have mustered the strength to get out.

Even it's so very gut wrenching to leave, I have to also forgive myself for wanting to stay.

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Seb
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« Reply #43 on: February 10, 2013, 07:21:56 PM »

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.

Yep - that is the entire point of this experiece. To learn.

It is the slap in the face that wakes us up to feeling for the first time. We go from not knowing ourselves at all, to knowing ourselves backwards. An amazing reward for the intense pain... .  if we do the work and really seek to understand what happened

Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

bb12

Exactly! Very well put. I am getting to know myself through all this, and in some bizarre way it feels like my life was leading up to this car crash of a r/s, in order to wake me up from this semi-existence. I am in the process of becoming emotionally healthy and mature, thanks to the nightmare of this r/s.

It's funny (but not!), I still sometimes catch myself wondering if I was the problem, and it wasn't her at all - she has blamed me for the demise of our r/s, and I'm someone that more than happily takes the blame too. So, its been good to remind myself of all the very unhealthy things she did and said. I think she did a great job gaslighting me! Those red flags aren't normal or healthy behaviours. Good to remember why I'm better off where I am now, even if it still hurts sometimes.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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lost007
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« Reply #44 on: February 10, 2013, 07:34:37 PM »

Five weeks in to our relationship my stbex told me someone had told her that I approached a woman- an aquaintance. I knew she and her husband. My stbex told me that in that approach I told this woman if her husband ever leaves her I would want to be with her. My stbex became very jealous. I had never said anything of the sort. I found myself defending my actions. And there were no actions to defend. It felt odd. Thought I could just say it didn't happen and that would be enough. 5 years later I've had countless affairs-in her mind. In reality I've never spoken out of turn to any woman as long as i have been with her. I have fought many battles that didn't exist. She told me that I would be fighting non existent problems 5 weeks in. I didn't listen.
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stevenq

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« Reply #45 on: February 10, 2013, 08:55:42 PM »

I too fell for the gaslighting. Man she was good at putting the blame on me so i was always feeling guilty. She constantly remined me how she didnt leave me when i didnt have a car and she had to do all the driving. I always felt obligated. She would tell me "i know a ton of guys who would kill to be in your shoes!" who says that? She was beautiful but very insecure. When i would breakup and she would call me back and tell me "im swallowing my pride and reaching out to u!" "im not perfect" that used to always get me to come back. I guess i thoght "she was seeing the light".
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findingmyselfagain
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« Reply #46 on: February 10, 2013, 09:39:43 PM »

In the first yahoo chat... .  *TWO* divorces at the age of 24 y/o with a 1 y/o from the second husband. Practically had sex on the first date. Looking back I recognize she had very few friends. We spent 4-5 days/nights a week together... .  besides me her "friends" were her co-workers who we hung out with very occasionally. Our communication was apparently pretty horrible. Though I was told constantly how wonderful I was, I was also accused of "tuning her out" and "interupting a lot" early on. I was usually pretty clueless to just how extremely insecure she was. I was constantly having to prove myself. This dynamic certainly reflected some my core wounds and issues, but a lot of it was pure healthy relationship ignorance. I would have put on the brakes much sooner with the knowledge I have now.
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faithfull

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« Reply #47 on: February 10, 2013, 10:22:15 PM »

1. Totally detached from mom.

2. love/hate dance with dad.

3. could'nt drive.

4. extreme idealization that made me very much uncomfortable.

5. constant lies.

6. So defensive against certain group/race, and idealize some others.

7. Very low self esteem.

8. Sleep problems.

9. OCD.

10. No friends.

11. Share so much of sexual details about her past ltr in early stages.

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bb12
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« Reply #48 on: February 11, 2013, 04:12:17 PM »

It's funny (but not!), I still sometimes catch myself wondering if I was the problem, and it wasn't her at all - she has blamed me for the demise of our r/s, and I'm someone that more than happily takes the blame too. So, its been good to remind myself of all the very unhealthy things she did and said. I think she did a great job gaslighting me! Those red flags aren't normal or healthy behaviours. Good to remember why I'm better off where I am now, even if it still hurts sometimes.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

Yeah - I know what you mean. I am so quick to own my part in any problem. Perhaps too quick. I have learned that I had / have extremely low self-esteem and the inability to really feel much at all. I am always intellectualising things and not doing enough examination of my feelings. And not knowing yourself = poor boundary setting. So when a pwBPD crosses the one or two boundaries we have managed to establish for ourselves, it can bring out some extreme behaviour in us. I look back at some of the things I did at the end... .  the neediness, the begging, the extinction bursts, the shouting... .  and I too feel gaslighted and conflicted about my part in the dance. Whether they brought this out of us in reaction to their craziness... .  or whether they are right in accusing us of the things they said we were. Who knows? But in my gut I feel that my behaviour was mostly normal and in direct unconscious reaction to the tricks they were trying. Either way, I forgive myself for them and am overjoyed at the growth I have experienced because of this whole thing.

BB12
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TheDude
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« Reply #49 on: February 11, 2013, 04:31:40 PM »

This deserves to be quoted at least once more:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

Yep.
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« Reply #50 on: March 10, 2013, 05:55:43 PM »

Our partners attractiveness seems to come a lot on these boards. Many of you have posted in this thread about the glaring red flags, yet stayed. This has much to do with our self esteem and worth than anything else.

A major hook for me was my partners looks/attractiveness - I felt like cinderella and had this amazing looking partner who idealized me. This says more about me than it does about him.

Banking the r/s on looks and attractiveness or the fact they are "hot" means we have a low opinion of our own looks/attractiveness. We feel special, wanted and loved because this "hot" person is with us.

Work on your self worth... .  if we really looked at those red flags we all posted we would detach in a minute - why is it that you are still hooked on this person?
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« Reply #51 on: March 10, 2013, 06:28:33 PM »

You see... .  this is a strange one for me. I wouldn't say that my ex was that "hot".

She would tell me all the time how lucky she was to be with me, how I was out of her league, that she fancied me so much. She made me feel beautiful... and no one had ever really done that (or so well) before.

I guess I loved being idealised, and it was more about how she made me feel attractive, rather than me basing it on her looks. I think as time went on I did find her more and more attractive - she had a killer body. I was intensely attracted to her in some way, but not so much, initially, based on her looks.

My hooks were emotional - here was someone that was madly in love with me, made me feel like I was the most beautiful person in the world... and had problems that I could fix. Silly me.
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syz

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« Reply #52 on: March 10, 2013, 06:29:23 PM »

The first red flag: How into me she was and how immediately she fell in love.  Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet.  

2nd red flag: How much she needed to process 'us' even when we were just friends.  It could never be a discussion and then dealt with.  We had to go over things for hours.  This is not normal in a friendship, its even excessive in most circumstances in a relationship until you've been together a long time and have accumulated a history together.  

3rd red flag:  the way she took things I said and turned them around.  In my defense I suspected she had dyslexia which later turned out to be correct.  My text messages weren't read correctly... she'd seize on one thing out of five I may have said and run with it out of context.  :)yslexia also includes audio processing so often dyslexics don't hear things correctly either.  But I was new to dyslexia the same way I was new to BPD.

4th red flag: at our age she should have some close friends.  We knew people in common but there were no close friends really.  she seemed to have some social anxiety and was kind of reclusive.  And hadn't been in a relationship in a long while because the last one was abusive.  I now don't know what to believe about that.  I didn't see the things most people see... there was no self harm I could discern, no sexual acting out, no substance abuse.  

Now all of the above should have kept me away from sleeping with her.  But I was stupid.  All of the above was somewhat intermittent because we were just friends during this time.  Once the relationship became sexual the facade dropped.  The processing increased dramatically with attacks on my motives and character.  The fear I was using her, the panic about things I could never totally figure out.  And then once I got spooked away and started to back away slowly then came the claws.  The accusations of being inappropriate sexually with a married guy friend of hers (I'm a lesbian).  

Her inappropriate sexual behaviour around me.  Texting me about dominating me and me begging for forgiveness (okay that is hot if you have that dynamic and have agreed to it... but not in this context once everything had blown the hell up between us) calling me and getting off on the phone/one sided phone sex once I was starting to back away from her.  

It took two months from beginning to end for it to explode out of control with the behaviour off the charts and getting worse.  The relationship going sexual was the trigger for all the BPD characteristics to be fully revealed.  

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Clearmind
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« Reply #53 on: March 10, 2013, 06:37:38 PM »

My hooks were emotional - here was someone that was madly in love with me, made me feel like I was the most beautiful person in the world... and had problems that I could fix. Silly me.

Me too – I got those from my ex because they were things, for many reasons I could not provide myself. A healthy person does not rely on a disordered person to fill a void.

Definitely a great point you made that we all need to explore more.

Thanks Seb for sharing.

The first red flag: How into me she was and how immediately she fell in love.  Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet. 

Bingo! Syz you are right – I never knew my ex and he never truly knew me.

The start of a healthy r/s we inquire, take our time to get to know one another.

Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet. 

I don’t believe there is any such thing as a soul mate – we are all independent people with independent thought – the idea of a soul mate = enmeshed/co-depedent r/s to me now.

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« Reply #54 on: March 10, 2013, 07:06:05 PM »

Bingo! Syz you are right – I never knew my ex and he never truly knew me.

The start of a healthy r/s we inquire, take our time to get to know one another.

Absolutely! This is exactly what I was saying to a friend the other day too... .  

My ex and I had met twice before we started dating. We slept together on the first date and within 3 weeks she was "completely in love" with me and had apparently wanted to tell me after 2 weeks.

I should have stepped of the ride to actually ask myself how this was possible, as she didn't know me after 2/3 weeks. I guess I was enjoying the idealisation far too much.
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« Reply #55 on: March 10, 2013, 07:23:48 PM »

It all seemed to be about chemistry, and conditioning that very little was actually about us as a couple.

When relating together on regular terms, without the dazzle of chemistry and magical thinking, I actually realized I didn't like him. Yet I persevered - against my better judgement.

Self trust is an important tool - for many reasons I chose to ignore my gut.
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« Reply #56 on: March 10, 2013, 07:32:50 PM »

It all seemed to be about chemistry, and conditioning that very little was actually about us as a couple.

When relating together on regular terms, without the dazzle of chemistry and magical thinking, I actually realized I didn't like him. Yet I persevered - against my better judgement.

Self trust is an important tool - for many reasons I chose to ignore my gut.

Yep, very true. I was 'straight' and here was this girl that was intensely attracted to me, and me to her. I didn't understand the why's or the how's but our chemistry was unlike anything I'd experienced before. I too ignored my better judgement and persevered. I think it all boiled down to me not ever thinking I'd find anyone that loved me like she did. I'd waited 29 years after all and I didn't want to lose that.

I was certainly guilty of projecting 'good' on to my exgf. I gave her qualities I desperately wanted her to have, but ones she simply didn't possess. I knew she didn't have the moral backbone and strength of character that I did, but I did a great job of ignoring my inner voice and forging ahead, moulding her in to the perfect girlfriend. I told myself how kind and beautiful she was, without much evidence looking back. I made her in to the person I wanted her to be.
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« Reply #57 on: March 10, 2013, 08:08:00 PM »

I was so inexperienced, but also should have never overlooked and accepted the excuses for her first 2 marriages.

I also should have known that it was doomed when she told me that she told her mom and aunt " I was her knight in shining armor"

who the f&*^ could possibly live up to that Ideal... .  Little did I know
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« Reply #58 on: March 10, 2013, 08:45:35 PM »

First  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) - but I ignored it because I enjoyed it - my uBPD husband put me on a pedestal unlike anything I had ever experienced.  He even told his family that I was perfect.

- wanted to advance the relationship quickly.

- extremely strong sex drive for a man in his 40s.

- seemed to have loose boundaries with ex-wife, who he has two kids with.  Seemed to alternate between high conflict and too friendly.

- family of origin issues - domestic violence between his parents, physical abuse by his dad.  Both parents have passed away but from what he's said about his mom she might have had narcissistic traits.

- drank too much at times, but not all the time.  Drinking too much all the time started after we married.

The major red flags began after we married - and we married too quickly after less than one year of seeing each other.

- shared intimate details about our r/s with others.

- started push/pull, silent treatment, and rages after we married.

- after we separated and I began therapy even though we were still in a "committed" r/s, he tried to contact women on FB and had some type of r/s with a woman at work though he swears it wasn't physical. (yes, I snooped through his phone)

- mood swings.

After we married, I learned more about him, including he slept with a LOT of women, cheated in many r/s, was cheated on in many r/s, was sexually abused as a very young child by a female babysitter.

Sometimes I feel like I married to a guy from a bad country song.
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« Reply #59 on: March 10, 2013, 08:49:15 PM »

I think a good rule of thumb for next time is not to ignore what my gut tells me even if you do not have a sufficient explanation for what is nagging me at the moment.  Its okay to put what I've noticed on the back burner until I  have further information but don't ignore it or let it slide.  

There are ways to bring these things up later without sounding like you are finding fault with their story.  think about it... try to understand what is bothering you and then when out again ask, "hey you know you said something that was interesting to me the other day... you were describing such and such and that it made you feel such and such... can you tell me a little more about that?"  

You sound interested, which you are, and not judgmental which you want to avoid.  

Another good tactic I think is getting people to discuss their ex's and subsequent breakups.  Is the ex to blame for everything?  because if they are you've got a problem.  Or is the ex 90% responsible for everything... still a problem.  I mean I know sometimes people unilaterally destroy relationships.  I had an ex that cheated, we had little strife between us up until that point, which may have been its own warning because she wasn't speaking up.  We had a good sex life.  When I talk about it now I think I understand there was something missing from the relationship... namely her.  That she has views of love that dictate it is supposed to fill us up and fix everything so we feel whole and not alone.  but that is the best I can give someone about that specific relationship since much of it is speculation.  She unilaterally destroyed us.  And I never got any meaningful answers.   But I certainly can't say that about every relationship.  I have made some errors and I have paid for them though I'm not bitter about it.  I had things to learn even if it hurt.  And that is something that comes through when I discuss certain exs you can tell I still care about them, respect them. etc.  

This is something I think worth exploring before we sleep with people.  Sure its more fun to talk about other things our favorite movies, music, our likes in general or things we think are funny.  But it is important to learn how they think about life, their values, what they actually really believe deep down.  Because that is the stuff that is going to sabotage the relationship not the fact that they like music that makes your hair stand on end... though I stipulate in my case as a music fiend it could also be deal breaker    
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