Home page of BPDFamily.com, online relationship supportMember registration here
January 27, 2021, 02:15:41 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins: Harri, Once Removed
Senior Ambassadors: Cat Familiar, I Am Redeemed, Mutt, Turkish
  Help!   Groups   Please Donate Login to Post New?--Click here to register  
bing
Experts share their discoveries [video]
100
Caretaking - What is it all about?
Margalis Fjelstad, PhD
Blame - why we do it?
Brené Brown, PhD
Family dynamics matter.
Alan Fruzzetti, PhD
A perspective on BPD
Ivan Spielberg, PhD
Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Why do you think they are better after us?  (Read 10362 times)
Deleted
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 209



« on: October 01, 2013, 06:56:14 PM »

Just out of curiosity... .


Why do you think your BPDex partner will be better or 'is' better with the next person? What's the reason behind this irrational fear?

It's worth noting that their life, however grand it may seem on social networking sites or elsewhere, is complete nonsense and a mask. But what I want to know is what is the reason behind YOUR thinking? Whats the reason behind this fear?
Logged
Johan
**
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 61


« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2013, 07:45:32 PM »

I reckon it's because we were left

- confused

- feeling like failures

- worthless

and when see them now we think it all double over... .

It's good to realise the 'mask' it's difficult when all seems so happy.

It's what makes me feel better, but have to get people to realise they aren't happy. I would be so jealous and think I'm worthless right now if it wasn't for learning about the illness and here... i hope shes back in therapy at the same time... .i want her to be happy, but i see the lies online and know its lies... .because i actually know... .

So i have so much sympathy for her but it all begins at home, you come 1st... .take a leafe out of their bok i say to myself...
Logged
simplyasiam
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 372


« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2013, 07:47:22 PM »

for me the fear came from seeing her change so fast and seem to be over the BPD made me feel like maybe i really was holding her back the reason for her troubles.

what i didnt know was she was really in super BPD mode nothing mattered but her and her wants.

six months latter shes in the same shape she was in last fall, depressed and starting the cycle over again
Logged
peas
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: single
Posts: 376


« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2013, 08:28:43 PM »

I love this thread question because it is a conundrum that befalls most of us exiting a BPD r/s.

My theories:

1) during the r/s they conditioned us to be weak, scared and miserable, so it's residual after they are gone and we assume they move on with the power we gave them

2) we tried hard to make them happy, they weren't satisfied, so it stands to "reason" that we were the problem and therefore a "better" situation for them is without us

A lot of the problem is in their communication. When these BPD r/s's end, we are given all the blame and made to feel bad. They convey this through hurtful language and tweaked logic.
Logged
eeyore
********
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: in a relationship
Posts: 5927



« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2013, 08:33:10 PM »

I personally don't think they are better.  But I'm currently not thinking that much about him.  I'm trying to just think about me and my personal growth.  I find contemplating what is going to happen to him unhealthy for me right now. 
Logged
Ironmanrises
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1774


« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2013, 09:00:08 PM »

If the non is still in the FOG... .

That probably answers your question.
Logged
bpdspell
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: Married.
Posts: 892


« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2013, 09:50:56 PM »

It's a complex answer but many of us believe the lie that we are "at fault" for not being good enough for them.

When we are abandoned and betrayed by them it triggers our deepest insecurities... .(insecurities that have lived inside of us before we met them)... .of not being worthy and them being with new supply validates that deeply held belief.

Feelings of unworthiness (on our part) are what often cause us to create a narrative of them being happier without us. It doesn't help that they are experts at "acting happy" when in truth they are shame filled, hate themselves and totally disconnected from reality.  My ex deserves an Academy Award for his ability to "keep up appearances" but on the inside he suffers tremendously.

I think we often get caught up in the facade and use this as validation that they're "normal", "happier" or better for someone else.

Lies. All Lies. Wherever they go their mental illness goes with them.

Spell
Logged
Oliolioxenfree
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 107


« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2013, 10:01:07 PM »

Why are they better after us?

Well the short answer is, they aren’t.

It’s a mask, and an illusion.   They love the honeymoon glow of new relationships, but cannot sustain true emotionally healthy connections with ANYONE.

I think a lot of our confusion and us thinking they are better stems from our own insecurities.  Over the course of the relationship they chipped away at our self esteem, we didn’t trust ourselves enough to leave (some of us did), but something inside of us gets triggered (just like it does to them) that this type of person doesn’t think we are good enough, but they miraculously change for the next person. Therefore we aren’t good enough.   Weve been conditioned to think this way.

The point is the next person is not better than you.  They were in the right place at the right time (or so they think... because its more like wrong place wrong time because their relationship will be a nightmare) and they really do not change.  Very very very very few do most don’t.  And to be honest, when they appear to change its that many times they will try harder with the next person because they want to impress them (remember when they did that with you?)  Chances are you got a little more than the partner before you.   Additionally, the next person/victim, may 1. Ignore red flags and have their own issues 2. Be just as messed up 3.  be more accepting of the poor behavior.  At this juncture, that is no longer you.

We feel like we need to be validated by them showing us they haven’t changed.  Its almost like, well At least they haven’t changed for the next person... The bottom line is that they are still hitty.

Think about it this way, anyone who treated you like garbage, then quickly moved on or even cheated and left for that person, is INCAPABLE of learning from the relationship and applying the lessons to their next one.  Because that type of behavior isn’t that of someone who is emotionally healthy.  Chances are unbelievably low that they have changed and if so will be able to  sustain it. This goes for people who aren’t disordered.  Now throw mental illness up in that equation and think about whether or not change is remotely possible.

Don’t be fooled at their blatant attempts to make you think they are happy, have changed , and have moved on.   Many on this board will tell you, and you will see (my BPDex included) the BPDex enjoys parading their new love interests on social media sites like they are the love of their life.  Give it time, itll end the same way as yours did. 

THEY. DON’T. CHANGE.

Logged
ThisIsMyNamelol

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 18


« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2013, 10:38:18 PM »

     It would be the only logical way to explain how someone could tell you they'll love you forever one minute, then leave you and be "in love" with someone else the next. The first thing I thought was, "Well, clearly she found something better." because otherwise, it's just not possible. But I'm just starting to come to terms with the fact that these people just don't think logically.

     My question is, what is "better" to people with BPD? Is there such a thing? Is there really any profound difference between a 2 month, or a 2 year relationship to them? Or does it all just fill the same niche? I'm still learning, so pardon my ignorance.
Logged
peas
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: single
Posts: 376


« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2013, 11:05:33 PM »

Maybe we should be thinking about how we were better before them.
Logged
musicfan42
*****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 509


« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2013, 12:31:35 AM »

I don't. My BPD ex is just the same-not any worse, not any better... just more of the same. I know that he'll just repeat the same relationship patterns again. I think he's stuck in Groundhog Day really in his life... just stuck.
Logged
UmbrellaBoy
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Gay, lesb
Posts: 116


« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2013, 12:47:35 AM »

I'll start by saying: we should genuinely hope that the ARE happier with the next person. If we've truly let go, then we should want them to have gotten better and be happy, even if it isn't with us, even if for some reason we were holding them back or they needed a blank slate and a fresh start before they could truly heal. Why we would fear their happiness is nothing but our own insecurity and envy and jealousy (and in that sense isn't really different from a normal romantic break-up).

However, if I've learned anything in learning that he was BPD... .it's that he is unlikely to pull a sudden change like that without therapy, that he's likely going to repeat similar patterns (especially since, in my case, he seems to have run back to another [alcoholic] ex from before me!) So what makes us entertain the doubt that maybe this time around things are going to go well for them (even if we should, actually, want that for them; but we all know the idea triggers our jealousy) when we know it is so unrealistic? I think that's also our insecurities. We were taken for such a roller-coaster ride, and at moments they seemed to love us so much (but couldn't sustain the commitment in their heads) that it is very invalidating to feel like maybe the strength of their love for someone else is now suddenly so strong as to overcome their deep-seated commitment issues, even though we tried so hard to be patient with those issues ourselves.

Yes, it is comforting thinking/knowing that it wasn't our fault, a lack of love, or a lack of attractiveness on our part. There is a schadenfreude in imagining that it's just going to keep happening to them because it means that their condition will be "its own natural punishment" for the ways it caused them to hurt us, that the best revenge is letting them self-destruct through the very same patterns they pulled with us. There is a justice to it.

I think most especially some of us want to believe it because a diagnosis of BPD helped us make sense of all the craziness in a way that didn't mean we were crazy ourselves, or desperately clinging to someone who "just wasn't that into" us. It also helps some of us cling to the hope (however much we deny it) that the new relationship is guaranteed to fall apart and that a recycle attempt with us then becomes almost inevitable (and we can do with it what we want: either try again, or shoot them down now that we'd have the upper-hand with the tables turned, them crawling back to us!)

But at the end of the day we should only use this crutch for so long, and eventually shouldn't fear the idea that they've gotten better and found happiness with someone else. It's unlikely, and maybe it would threaten the narrative of BPD that allowed us to make sense of how they treated us, and it takes away the hope of justice and future recycles... .but if we truly let go, we should want them to be happy even if it is with someone else, even if the change that cures them comes on suddenly and apart from us in spite of all our own efforts over the course of the relationship to be the one with whom things would be different. Indeed, if such an unlikely turn-around were to happen with their next person (or someone else down the line) we can rest assured, I think, that after such a change they will look back with remorse (in their new self-awareness) at the way they treated past relationships, and that what they went through with us contributed in some small degree to their gaining the self-knowledge that eventually allowed them to change or get help.

But, yeah, it's unlikely. So yay schadenfreude and the ability to blame things on a personality disorder and hope for a recycle in a few months!
Logged

Ironmanrises
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1774


« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2013, 04:45:54 AM »

I'll start by saying: we should genuinely hope that the ARE happier with the next person. If we've truly let go, then we should want them to have gotten better and be happy, even if it isn't with us, even if for some reason we were holding them back or they needed a blank slate and a fresh start before they could truly heal. Why we would fear their happiness is nothing but our own insecurity and envy and jealousy (and in that sense isn't really different from a normal romantic break-up).

However, if I've learned anything in learning that he was BPD... .it's that he is unlikely to pull a sudden change like that without therapy, that he's likely going to repeat similar patterns (especially since, in my case, he seems to have run back to another [alcoholic] ex from before me!) So what makes us entertain the doubt that maybe this time around things are going to go well for them (even if we should, actually, want that for them; but we all know the idea triggers our jealousy) when we know it is so unrealistic? I think that's also our insecurities. We were taken for such a roller-coaster ride, and at moments they seemed to love us so much (but couldn't sustain the commitment in their heads) that it is very invalidating to feel like maybe the strength of their love for someone else is now suddenly so strong as to overcome their deep-seated commitment issues, even though we tried so hard to be patient with those issues ourselves.

Yes, it is comforting thinking/knowing that it wasn't our fault, a lack of love, or a lack of attractiveness on our part. There is a schadenfreude in imagining that it's just going to keep happening to them because it means that their condition will be "its own natural punishment" for the ways it caused them to hurt us, that the best revenge is letting them self-destruct through the very same patterns they pulled with us. There is a justice to it.

I think most especially some of us want to believe it because a diagnosis of BPD helped us make sense of all the craziness in a way that didn't mean we were crazy ourselves, or desperately clinging to someone who "just wasn't that into" us. It also helps some of us cling to the hope (however much we deny it) that the new relationship is guaranteed to fall apart and that a recycle attempt with us then becomes almost inevitable (and we can do with it what we want: either try again, or shoot them down now that we'd have the upper-hand with the tables turned, them crawling back to us!)

But at the end of the day we should only use this crutch for so long, and eventually shouldn't fear the idea that they've gotten better and found happiness with someone else. It's unlikely, and maybe it would threaten the narrative of BPD that allowed us to make sense of how they treated us, and it takes away the hope of justice and future recycles... .but if we truly let go, we should want them to be happy even if it is with someone else, even if the change that cures them comes on suddenly and apart from us in spite of all our own efforts over the course of the relationship to be the one with whom things would be different. Indeed, if such an unlikely turn-around were to happen with their next person (or someone else down the line) we can rest assured, I think, that after such a change they will look back with remorse (in their new self-awareness) at the way they treated past relationships, and that what they went through with us contributed in some small degree to their gaining the self-knowledge that eventually allowed them to change or get help.

But, yeah, it's unlikely. So yay schadenfreude and the ability to blame things on a personality disorder and hope for a recycle in a few months!

In bold.

I get what you are trying to say.

You should wish an ex partner happiness with the next person... .

However... .

That would only apply to someone that respectfully exited the relationship.

Someone with BPD does not respectfully exit a relationship.

If you read the accounts here... .

You will notice a scary pattern of... .

Abrupt cut off... .

Switching on/off of feelings... .

Cheating... .

PwBPD usually leaving the non... .

Then returning... .

To leave yet again... .

With the same exact pattern of behavior as before.


Logged
snappafcw
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 295


« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2013, 05:07:39 AM »

I have nothing but love and compassion for my ex and I wish her happiness despite her lies and possible cheating and definite deception. It starts from me. I saw so many red flags and I ignored them that part of It i have to own. Her part of it she isn't capable of owning which means unless she gets help she will treat people like this for the rest of her life. Having people hate her on an ongoing basis is going to be torture and I don't wish that on her or anyone. I really hope one day she gets help and will be happily married with a family... .

I still wish it was me and It was all a lie and I still hurt you don't just get over falling in love. But I forgive her and wish her happiness no matter how much it hurts me and that again is the issue i need to deal with within myself... .
Logged
goldylamont
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1083



« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2013, 05:59:02 AM »

i don't really trust someone who wishes an abusive ex good tidings unless it's been at least several years of NC and healing going on. IMO nons can abuse the idea of forgiveness as a way to avoid feeling true grief/anger, which in the right context is where true health and growth reside (in the earlier stages of recovery).

to me, forgiveness simply means, this person can no longer hurt me, in any way.

if you bumped into your ex today happily making out with your replacement portraying the good life that you are saying you wish for them--would you feel nervous/sad/angry/anxious in any way? if so then i feel it's more important to trust what our bodies are telling us--that this person can still hurt us, and don't worry so much about forgiveness (yet).

sorry if this is countering some others posts... .this isn't directed at people here i've just had friends who do this; talking about forgiveness when i don't feel like it's all the way true. to me, nons use "forgiveness" the same way a BPD would use "happiness"--to try and project to the world that they are stronger than they may actually feel. of course, there's exceptions to this rule, my apologies if this isn't true for you.
Logged
snappafcw
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 295


« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2013, 06:20:50 AM »

I think your post is a little general and unfair. If i saw my ex with a new man of course id be shattered, nervous and anxious... .and hurt. I still wish her well I'm trying to be the bigger man and just trust in my good values and work on my shortcomings
Logged
snappafcw
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 295


« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2013, 06:32:51 AM »

Society these days has a very bitter and resentful view on things at times... .I feel sadness and anger but  I never want to hate I just want to let go... .Its a part of my Christian beliefs but I won't go into it as i think its fair to keep this place neutral.

I'm from perfect I'm trying to do the right thing though even if those around me will not. Like a lot of people here say I can't control them but I can control who I let in.
Logged
mitchell16
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 829


« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2013, 08:46:50 AM »

It’s a mask, and an illusion.   They love the honeymoon glow of new relationships, but cannot sustain true emotionally healthy connections with ANYONE.

Mine said on our last contact " I wish we could go back to the way it was in the beginning" of course who doesnt? In my opiion the honeymoon phase of any relationship is the most exciting part but that gets replaced with deep love, caring and being supportive, deveolping life goals with each. Nobody can stay in the honeymoon phase of anything forever. a New relationship, a new job, new friends, a child being born, anything. everything evolves to a next level. Just my opinion.

Mine right now appears better. of course she is right she has no stress of a relationship. She not trying to be what she cant be. She wants it but cant do it. so it create internal stress on her all the time. What bothers me, instead of excepting that. She blames me and says things about me that are not true as a way of blaming. This is where I get stuck, because I blame my short cummings on myself. I was in a relationship once, when I was very young. I cheated on her. I felt terrible I told her what I did. She would have forgave, said she would. I ended the relationship I was not in love with her. I took full repsonbility it was all me. I could have told her it was her fault, that she was this or that. But that wasnt true. It was all me. and to this day me and that person are still great friends and have been for 25 years. I think it was becasue I was honest and didnt make her feel bad about herself because it didnt have anything to to do with her, it was my own insecurities that caused it.

my ex wife and me are great friends. She called yeasturday and was talking about her new boyfriend and how happy they are. I truly wished her well and I am happy for her. Why? because we both made mistake in our relationship, we owned them, we didnt drag each other thru the mud, we didnt insult each other. we just relaized we couldnt stay togther anymore. it just wasnt working. I wish her the best and I am happy for her.

my exBPD. I have nothing but hate, anger and i wish her nothing but misery at this point. She dont deserve compassion. she dont deserve respect, she dont deserve kindness. She deserves to be stepped on. Thats the way I feel right now. I know she is a sick person. But she is wealthy, highly educated and has admitted that she knows something is wrong with her but will not get help. but instead chooses to to unleash hell on society. and thats what makes me depise her.
Logged
Deleted
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 209



« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2013, 09:42:29 AM »

very good insights on here! Thank you all for replying... Just curious as to how other people thought about this

I'm at a point that I am indifferent about my exBPD. I don't wish her well but I most certainly don't wish her any harm or vindicative karma or what have you. I tried so hard at the beginning of my recovery to think why she would be automatically better with the next person and all I conjure is that in my past relationships with NONs (this was my first one and shortest relationship) 

We usually learn from our past partners and work on our flaws. I've seen almost all my ex girlfriends a lot better with their next partner but at the same time they had a sane mentality, there was closure, they had a mature mentality, and the relationship was obviously not tumultuous. I guess I applied the same logic to this relationship. 

Mitchell, I understand where you are coming from-

my exBPD. I have nothing but hate, anger and i wish her nothing but misery at this point. She dont deserve compassion. she dont deserve respect, she dont deserve kindness. She deserves to be stepped on. Thats the way I feel right now. I know she is a sick person. But she is wealthy, highly educated and has admitted that she knows something is wrong with her but will not get help. but instead chooses to to unleash hell on society. and thats what makes me depise her.

In time you will slowly let go of those feelings into a state of indifference. I see my BPDex the same way, well almost the same way, as I do my other ex girlfriends. I'm at a state of indifference, there is still some sort of "love" for them but it's a "hope you're well, but stay where you are My life is fine without you" I was once at your point. I was consumed by my hate for her but I realized this made me think about her more.

By hating her, I gave her such power over me. I took a mentally ill, immature, little girl trapped in a womans body and I gave her a Superwoman cape and special powers. She's not superwoman, she's what I described in the last sentence. By hating her, I was never going to get over her. I totally understand where you are coming from I'm not trying to be dismissive but at least for me, the day I said I took part in the relationship as well, BPD or not, she's destructive and not good for me, and I STAYED! I have fault for the way I feel. I put my ego aside and forgave her.
Logged
mitchell16
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 829


« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2013, 10:23:31 AM »

I wish I didnt feel that way and in time I hope I wont. But in my mind its like someone who is sick but wont go to the doctor and get better but expects everyone else to make special treatment for them. It dont make sense. if you dont want to get better fine, live with it but dont expect the world give you special treatment. I know its a mental disorder and its diffrent. But mine has told me she knows she is a mess, she knows " shes broke and cant be fixed" her words. Like I said she in a mental health therapist. so why not get help. If you didnt know I could understand but she knows and has said it it. She has never said BPD but told me once she had BPD traits. I guess Im still at the angy stage and I pray i do let it go.
Logged
Deleted
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 209



« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2013, 10:44:11 AM »

Mitchell, MY BPDex suffered from sexual abuse, broken home, alcoholic father, mother with NPD, horrible marriage between the two, abusive boyfriends the list goes on.

Her behavior can be directly linked to her childhood and her traumatic experience (granted it's not BPD distortion as horrible as it may sound). She is an adult, a working, intelligent adult. She is not 'crazy' in the sense that she doesn't wear a bikini when it's -10 degrees out, nor does she talk to the many voices in her mind. But she does need years and years of therapy. It's unfortuante what happened to her but I, as a human, cannot help her with that. She would need many medications and years of therapy something I cannot do. If I switch my role of boyfriend to therapist, what type of relationship would that be?

My BPDex would often cry and say I'm a mess, I can't have a relationship, these people ruined that for me, I'm damaged goods. She went to a therapist 2 times and quickly said NO THEY JUST DON'T GET ME I HATE THEM THEY ARE B*TCHES! and never went back. She knows she is messed up and needs severe help but is too scared and immature to seek it. I understand 100% your feelings and pain in your last post but we did stay regardless of their behavior and past. It's also our fault. They are chaotic and irresponsbile for not seeking help and in that sense I do blame her.

However, with all of those traumatic experiences, how can you? where would you start? she would need to stop and drop everything in her life live in a therapist office for years. When it comes to that, I don't have BPD nor do I have any crazy experience like that so I cannot feel the fear they may have for seeking help. This does not mitigate their behavior. I find their lack of seeking for help irresponsible, immature, and selfish yet maybe I just don't understand because I've never gone through such harsh things. I don't know, but I do find their response to just playing the victim card or martyr when they know they are messed up completely selfish.
Logged
snappafcw
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 295


« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2013, 10:57:12 AM »

Thanks for your insight deleted. My ex's background is very similar including the sexual abuse as a young child and my feelings are also very much like yours. Its nice to be able to relate thank you.
Logged
allweareisallweare
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 115



« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2013, 11:12:16 AM »

Oh, I don't think they're better tbh -  I don't buy the BS FB facade (which she will try to keep up long after I have blocked her I know, which I have, just to convince others - not that she's happy but that she's not mentally unwell - which is impossible because that's what she is.

I wouldn't like to be in their shoes. I know that she altered her profile picture to show herself and the new guy, I mean victim, but she looked unhappy in that... .obviously, she thinks that using this social networking 'weapon' paradigm will save her from guilt consuming them, but it won't; I knew she was sick and I don't really succumb to thinking that I could have done more or feel guilt for blocking her to lead to the whole change of events (she needed any excuse tbh her behavior warranted it) when I was corresponding with her I reiterated that I knew what pattern would ensue, and I mentioned BPD (because she told me she had been diagnosed with it, so it's no secret) but I do regret not having been on this board at that time, because I would have properly PROPERLY spelled it out to her what A) Had happened in our relationship B) Will happen in this current one but now NC has ensued on my part so ... .but surely she knows - in those lonely hours it must scare her? Again, I don't have that worry.

What we have to understand is we can look at relationships objectively - they're difficult things to maintain; the'll be a honeymoon period naturally; they'll be conflict anyway, they may miss us 'anyway' - then when we apply that subjectively (the x having BPD) we encounter something which is almost unfathomably dangerous, challenging, menacing. True, a combination we encountered, lived through, survived; but they have to do it again and again and again... .so why would I think they're happier/better? Nothing can alter my skepticism into thinking that the person I was with won't fail - they failed seemingly in every relationship prior very quickly, implied they had been used in others, left in others etc. I stuck at it much more than I believe only a small number would - it had significance, it was my first relationship etc, but I am a fighter - I have to be it's self-explanatory. Sometimes I don't know why I am fighting on.[/size]

Peace



Logged
SeekerofTruth
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 235



« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2013, 11:39:32 AM »

Excerpt
That would only apply to someone that respectfully exited the relationship.

Someone with BPD does not respectfully exit a relationship.

If you read the accounts here... .

You will notice a scary pattern of... .

Abrupt cut off... .

Switching on/off of feelings... .

Cheating... .

PwBPD usually leaving the non... .

Then returning... .

To leave yet again... .

With the same exact pattern of behavior as before.

it's like we just some object in a game of abuse.

Excerpt
i don't really trust someone who wishes an abusive ex good tidings unless it's been at least several years of NC and healing going on. IMO nons can abuse the idea of forgiveness as a way to avoid feeling true grief/anger, which in the right context is where true health and growth reside (in the earlier stages of recovery).

to me, forgiveness simply means, this person can no longer hurt me, in any way. 

Because of the trauma and damage THEY caused... .and suppossedly we let happen because we did not know how to protect ourselves and other codependent jargon.  Still don't make it right.  Taking the high road? what's the high road to them?  Another angle to pizz on you.  especially if they have comorbid NPD.

Excerpt
Yes, it is comforting thinking/knowing that it wasn't our fault, a lack of love, or a lack of attractiveness on our part. There is a schadenfreude in imagining that it's just going to keep happening to them because it means that their condition will be "its own natural punishment" for the ways it caused them to hurt us, that the best revenge is letting them self-destruct through the very same patterns they pulled with us. There is a justice to it.


There's truth in them there words.  I NEVER knew or allowed myself to harbor bitterness towards anyone (maybe my dad); till i drowned in her toxcity, manipulative abusive control, and mindfuk denial projection circularity games.

Excerpt
conundrum that befalls most of us exiting a BPD r/s.

My theories:

1) during the r/s they conditioned us to be weak, scared and miserable, so it's residual after they are gone and we assume they move on with the power we gave them

2) we tried hard to make them happy, they weren't satisfied, so it stands to "reason" that we were the problem and therefore a "better" situation for them is without us

A lot of the problem is in their communication. When these BPD r/s's end, we are given all the blame and made to feel bad. They convey this through hurtful language and tweaked logic. 

And some times the further down they drag you thru the mud and dirt is the only place left from which to pick your self up from, with tire marks on your back.  The splitting and hate is so severe and just dimissed, along with you as some disgarded object which was once a prize possession.  And to think they get off on that?  Yeah, when they have no repentance, show no remorse or ammends... .no... .that forgivenss for them gets withheld... .till we deal with what we need to deal with first.  YOu don't just forgive that no matter what pop psychology says.  There has to be a process of just how severely they messed with us.
Logged
Bananas
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 346



« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2013, 12:23:15 PM »

For me it is just a lot of second guessing as my ex is undiagnosed. 

The logical Bananas says: look at the pattern of relationships and friendships he has had his whole life, add the fact that his mother was mentally ill, how much proof do you need?

The emotional Bananas second guesses.  Maybe he is not ill and it was just me.

i don't really trust someone who wishes an abusive ex good tidings unless it's been at least several years of NC and healing going on. IMO nons can abuse the idea of forgiveness as a way to avoid feeling true grief/anger, which in the right context is where true health and growth reside (in the earlier stages of recovery).

For me, this is important.  I was taught to always be nice and forgive.  I am just getting to a point now where I am starting to feel anger because I did stuff a lot of it.  I was really in a hurry to forgive my ex, I think before I was ready. 

Maybe we should be thinking about how we were better before them.

OR, maybe we should be thinking about how much better we will be after them, even better than before them. 


Logged
Deleted
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 209



« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2013, 10:28:33 PM »

Bananas, besides seeing my non exes better with the next guy, which stung a bit at the time, I kinda always feared that maybe she isn't really BPD and maybe it was just me who caused that.

But I quickly thought about her past and issues and there is no way it was me. In addition, I kinda strayed from the solely focusing on her BPD. Bpd or not, she needs help, it was stupid of me to stay for 8 months. I think it's  more important to realize that BPD or not, they were toxic to us and in some way we were toxic to them because we triggered them even if we didn't notice or even know we were.

Snappa,

It's unfortunate we had/have to go through the same circumstances but it's beautiful to see that there Others out there who understand.


Wishing everyone lots of strength!
Logged
snappafcw
****
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 295


« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2013, 10:37:08 PM »

I don't think there is a problem with me wanting to forgive and have a soft hart. Thats not to say I haven't felt heaps of anger and sadness but each to their own.
Logged
Ironmanrises
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1774


« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2013, 10:43:43 PM »

Bananas, besides seeing my non exes better with the next guy, which stung a bit at the time, I kinda always feared that maybe she isn't really BPD and maybe it was just me who caused that.

But I quickly thought about her past and issues and there is no way it was me. In addition, I kinda strayed from the solely focusing on her BPD. Bpd or not, she needs help, it was stupid of me to stay for 8 months. I think it's  more important to realize that BPD or not, they were toxic to us and in some way we were toxic to them because we triggered them even if we didn't notice or even know we were.

Snappa,

It's unfortunate we had/have to go through the same circumstances but it's beautiful to see that there Others out there who understand.


Wishing everyone lots of strength!

In bold.

I respectfully disagree.

Whether our feelings for the pwBPD were misplaced or not... .

We were not toxic to them because we triggered them... .

We triggered them... .

Because they are disordered.

They are toxic to us.

Logged
Bananas
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 346



« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2013, 11:14:28 PM »

Bananas, besides seeing my non exes better with the next guy, which stung a bit at the time, I kinda always feared that maybe she isn't really BPD and maybe it was just me who caused that.

But I quickly thought about her past and issues and there is no way it was me. In addition, I kinda strayed from the solely focusing on her BPD. Bpd or not, she needs help, it was stupid of me to stay for 8 months. I think it's  more important to realize that BPD or not, they were toxic to us and in some way we were toxic to them because we triggered them even if we didn't notice or even know we were.



Wishing everyone lots of strength!

Yep you are right about this.  My ex and I were friends for about a year before we got intimate and things were fine as I wasn't a trigger.  He actually said that of his ex before me, "we were better off as friends", so now I assume he says the same about me. Now there is no going back. 
Logged
goldylamont
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1083



« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2013, 02:55:00 AM »

I don't think there is a problem with me wanting to forgive and have a soft hart. Thats not to say I haven't felt heaps of anger and sadness but each to their own.

snappafcw, didn't want to put you on the fences here. everybody is different and perhaps you are able to forgive sooner than others (although i'm unsure of your timeframe). it's good and honorable to strive for forgiveness. trust me that's my main goal now, full forgiveness. it's just that i don't work towards it, it's something i feel will occur naturally for me over time as i fully heal. my path is nothing less than complete detachment, moving on, finding someone more beautiful and total indifference to my ex. << this is forgiveness to me--my behavior and true emotions. and i'm so much closer than i was a year ago!  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

so for me that's why i a bit wary when i hear so much talk of forgiveness, simply b/c i think that my definition of forgiveness is different from the status quo. and i have to accept this, i sometimes look at things different.

but perhaps that is a good question for everyone--what does forgiveness look like for you? and have you truly forgiven your BPDex by this standard?

Logged
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2021?

Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Our 2020 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
40days_in_desert
Ahquei3s
alphabeta
Amethyste
Angie59
ArtistGuy70
AskingWhy
assumezero
At Bay
Avanzando
Baglady
Beneck
bigredneck
Bittlecat
Boll Weevil
calmboom
Cat Familiar
Chosen
Dnmtnbkr
drained1996
Eggshellsbroken
FaintTheGoat
FaithHopeLove
FindingMe2011
Forgiveness
freespirit
GaGrl
ggGreg
Gift to Myself
gotbushels
Harri
hopeandchoices
I Am Redeemed
Imatter33
Jazzy48
jdc
jones54
Jonthan
Katrinalove
Kwamina
l8kgrl
LLgreen
Longterm
lorymac
lovenature
loyalwife
lucidone
Manifest32f
MariannaR
Meridius
Methuen
mgirl
Minttea
Mommydoc
Mutt
narcdaughter2
needPeace
NorseWoman
Notgoneyet
oceanheart
oftentimes
Omega1
once removed
Only Human
otherlife
palynne
PeacefulMom
Pedro
pest947
podsnapG
ProudDad12
pursuingJoy
Radcliff
Raul
Recycle
Resiliant
Rev
Rosheger
Sad4Her
SamwizeGamgee
Sandalwood
SBBayArea
SCM
SerendipityChild
SES
Silverhope
Skip
songbirdtwo
StillStuck
Swimmy55
Teno
townhouse
truthbeknown
turtleengine501
Ventak
vinnie77
Violet00
wavewatcher
wendydarling
WhatJustHappened?
Whichwayisup
whirlpoollife
Wicker Man
WindofChange
worn_out
WTL
zachira
zaqsert

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2020, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!