Okay, trying the being friends thing

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

They don't know how to be a "friend". They may say they want to be friends, but they don't understand the concept of mutual respect, care and concern. I tried being friends with mine, at no point over the course of 5 months, did he ever ask once about me or my life. I care about him and always will, but I care about him from a far. I remind myself that how he treats me says more about him than it does me.

Try it if you feel like you need to, but don't go into it with any expectations, or a friendship that mirrors other friends in your life. You are swimming in an emotionally shallow pool with a pwBPD, if you expect depth when diving in, you'll hit your head and end up getting hurt.

[Tater tot]

They don't know how to be a "friend". They may say they want to be friends, but they don't understand the concept of mutual respect, care and concern. I tried being friends with mine, at no point over the course of 5 months, did he ever ask once about me or my life. I care about him and always will, but I care about him from a far. I remind myself that how he treats me says more about him than it does me.

Try it if you feel like you need to, but don't go into it with any expectations, or a friendship that mirrors other friends in your life. You are swimming in an emotionally shallow pool with a pwBPD, if you expect depth when diving in, you'll hit your head and end up getting hurt.

[willtimeheal]

Your dog dies. Do you keep it?

Perfidy... .Straight forward and to the point. I have missed reading your posts!  Glad I came across one!

[maric]

I'd rather be friend a snake

[/quote

LOL

[kc sunshine]

thanks you all for your words of wisdom, caution, and concern! So what I'm hearing from lots of these responses is that when trying to be friends, people end up feeling used and that the relationship is one-sided (where the NON is doing all the giving and the BPD is doing all the taking). I can totally see how that could be. The other sucky thing is the prospect of hearing about the replacement etc. Ugh, I would hate that right now but maybe I'll detach enough through the transition to friendship process (fake it til you make it) that it won't be so bad when it happens (inevitably). And yup, Rifka, I totally still have that walking on eggshells feeling when we're talking about stuff related to my life... .the upside of her narcissism though is that we don't talk about my life stuff that much, so it reduces the eggshell-feeling . She is friends with two of her other exes, so I know it is a possibility for her/with her. We talked tonight and it was okay, though a little tough to get off the phone.

[tim_tom]

The fog makes it difficult to see the whole picture and we ourselves tend to fall into black or white thinking when recounting the rs.

Projective identification?

But seriously, I know she's not all bad and she did many many nice things. But big picture, she's behaved abhorrently and continues to do so. Sure, she's disordered, but that is get out of treating people like crap free card

[tim_tom]

thanks you all for your words of wisdom, caution, and concern! So what I'm hearing from lots of these responses is that when trying to be friends, people end up feeling used and that the relationship is one-sided (where the NON is doing all the giving and the BPD is doing all the taking). I can totally see how that could be. The other sucky thing is the prospect of hearing about the replacement etc. Ugh, I would hate that right now but maybe I'll detach enough through the transition to friendship process (fake it til you make it) that it won't be so bad when it happens (inevitably). And yup, Rifka, I totally still have that walking on eggshells feeling when we're talking about stuff related to my life... .the upside of her narcissism though is that we don't talk about my life stuff that much, so it reduces the eggshell-feeling . She is friends with two of her other exes, so I know it is a possibility for her/with her. We talked tonight and it was okay, though a little tough to get off the phone.

Why do you want to be friends with her?

You are only hurting yourself and going to prolong your misery

[Mutt]

KC,

I don't think there's a right or wrong. Understanding she's a person with feelings and is disordered is fine. You know what you can handle and can't. You know your threshold. If you're indifferent to her behaviors that's understandable. Be careful and avoid the pitfalls.

Look out for your needs first. Don't put her needs first or you're gonna get hurt.

--Mutt

[Perfidy]

Be honest. You want to be more than friends. Sex. That's what you want because it was the best you've ever had. That's how we roll. Then emotion takes over. Bad. Your desire is what is causing your suffering. Very complex. Can't figure it out with a few words and a reply to your post. Complex and complicated. Frustrating. Figure yourself out. Only you can. No one else. You can't figure anyone else but yourself out.

[anxiety5]

Nothing and Nobody will convince you not to be friends with her. Come on guys, we all know that. How many times did we ignore our friends, our family, or just the look on their faces without saying anything yet screaming a look that said "this person is not right for you" We even ignore ourselves. That's why we are here.

That being said, this is really one of those situations where you have to touch the stove to realize it will burn you. No matter what we might say, you will not listen.

I was the exact same way. I even tricked myself into thinking I was somehow in control. Like I had the upper hand.

Your friendship will start off pretty hot. Intense. That's because she's a control freak and gets off on the fact she still has you sitting in her bed naked, yet has no obligation to you whatsoever. That is exciting to her. You take it as going smooth. You can have her back any day now, if you want her. What will happen is she will start doing things like disappearing after 5pm on a Saturday. Her phone will be turned off, and you won't have any way to reach her. All as you were in the middle of trading texts, and things seemed to be one step away from getting back together. Meanwhile, you've been keeping her company on texts as she gets ready for her night out with your replacement or some random person she just met. She will start lying to you because she feels no obligation to tell you the truth, and that alone is so disrespectful and something "Friends" don't do. You will inevitably either have your ego damaged by realizing you are her B or C option, or by the simple fact she lies to YOU in order to make time for SOMEONE ELSE. You will try to fight back, maybe shun her, etc. But you will soon realize she does.not.care. Once you act too clingy one time when she's onto someone else, you are gone. Once you criticize her once for her lying to you, you're gone. Then the major ego hit comes to you. When you realize, SHE COULD NOT POSSIBLY CARE ANY LESS that you are hurting. Intact, she thinks you are pathetic. She is doing stuff with other guys and you are stalking her Facebook or frantically texting her and she doesn't respond. Eventually you'll get fed up and pull away. You will be JUST getting to a point of stability and feeling better and you'll get a text from her. You have a great conversation but she never replies back when you ask to see her sometime. Another victory for her. And another ego hit for you. She will continue doing this, showing up, calling or texting all at the oddest times as if she knows when you are almost over her. And each time you fall for it and it keeps your infatuation towards here always there under the surface. This will continue as long a as you let it. Just watch. If she wanted to be with you she would be. The fact she isn't means she's already decided there isn't anything left from your soul for her to take.

Unless you are a masochist with some cuckold fetish, you are going to end up feeling miserable, discarded like a piece of trash, invalidated, defeated, worthless, shunned and hopeless. That's because you were just played like a drum. Used. Sucked dry.  And the worse you are, the bigger heartbreaker she'll feel like.

You are playing with fire. You'll see. Soon enough.

[drummerboy]

Great post anxiety, brilliant.

If you really want to contact her, tell her you just got diagnosed with an STD and she should get tested. That gets you a victory (her anxiety will go into overdrive) and ensures she won't contact you, win-win!

Nothing and Nobody will convince you not to be friends with her. Come on guys, we all know that. How many times did we ignore our friends, our family, or just the look on their faces without saying anything yet screaming a look that said "this person is not right for you" We even ignore ourselves. That's why we are here.

That being said, this is really one of those situations where you have to touch the stove to realize it will burn you. No matter what we might say, you will not listen.

I was the exact same way. I even tricked myself into thinking I was somehow in control. Like I had the upper hand.

Your friendship will start off pretty hot. Intense. That's because she's a control freak and gets off on the fact she still has you sitting in her bed naked, yet has no obligation to you whatsoever. That is exciting to her. You take it as going smooth. You can have her back any day now, if you want her. What will happen is she will start doing things like disappearing after 5pm on a Saturday. Her phone will be turned off, and you won't have any way to reach her. All as you were in the middle of trading texts, and things seemed to be one step away from getting back together. Meanwhile, you've been keeping her company on texts as she gets ready for her night out with your replacement or some random person she just met. She will start lying to you because she feels no obligation to tell you the truth, and that alone is so disrespectful and something "Friends" don't do. You will inevitably either have your ego damaged by realizing you are her B or C option, or by the simple fact she lies to YOU in order to make time for SOMEONE ELSE. You will try to fight back, maybe shun her, etc. But you will soon realize she does.not.care. Once you act too clingy one time when she's onto someone else, you are gone. Once you criticize her once for her lying to you, you're gone. Then the major ego hit comes to you. When you realize, SHE COULD NOT POSSIBLY CARE ANY LESS that you are hurting. Intact, she thinks you are pathetic. She is doing stuff with other guys and you are stalking her Facebook or frantically texting her and she doesn't respond. Eventually you'll get fed up and pull away. You will be JUST getting to a point of stability and feeling better and you'll get a text from her. You have a great conversation but she never replies back when you ask to see her sometime. Another victory for her. And another ego hit for you. She will continue doing this, showing up, calling or texting all at the oddest times as if she knows when you are almost over her. And each time you fall for it and it keeps your infatuation towards here always there under the surface. This will continue as long a as you let it. Just watch. If she wanted to be with you she would be. The fact she isn't means she's already decided there isn't anything left from your soul for her to take.

Unless you are a masochist with some cuckold fetish, you are going to end up feeling miserable, discarded like a piece of trash, invalidated, defeated, worthless, shunned and hopeless. That's because you were just played like a drum. Used. Sucked dry.  And the worse you are, the bigger heartbreaker she'll feel like.

You are playing with fire. You'll see. Soon enough.

[anxiety5]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD. 

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

[Blimblam]

Nothing and Nobody will convince you not to be friends with her. Come on guys, we all know that. How many times did we ignore our friends, our family, or just the look on their faces without saying anything yet screaming a look that said "this person is not right for you" We even ignore ourselves. That's why we are here.

That being said, this is really one of those situations where you have to touch the stove to realize it will burn you. No matter what we might say, you will not listen.

I was the exact same way. I even tricked myself into thinking I was somehow in control. Like I had the upper hand.

Your friendship will start off pretty hot. Intense. That's because she's a control freak and gets off on the fact she still has you sitting in her bed naked, yet has no obligation to you whatsoever. That is exciting to her. You take it as going smooth. You can have her back any day now, if you want her. What will happen is she will start doing things like disappearing after 5pm on a Saturday. Her phone will be turned off, and you won't have any way to reach her. All as you were in the middle of trading texts, and things seemed to be one step away from getting back together. Meanwhile, you've been keeping her company on texts as she gets ready for her night out with your replacement or some random person she just met. She will start lying to you because she feels no obligation to tell you the truth, and that alone is so disrespectful and something "Friends" don't do. You will inevitably either have your ego damaged by realizing you are her B or C option, or by the simple fact she lies to YOU in order to make time for SOMEONE ELSE. You will try to fight back, maybe shun her, etc. But you will soon realize she does.not.care. Once you act too clingy one time when she's onto someone else, you are gone. Once you criticize her once for her lying to you, you're gone. Then the major ego hit comes to you. When you realize, SHE COULD NOT POSSIBLY CARE ANY LESS that you are hurting. Intact, she thinks you are pathetic. She is doing stuff with other guys and you are stalking her Facebook or frantically texting her and she doesn't respond. Eventually you'll get fed up and pull away. You will be JUST getting to a point of stability and feeling better and you'll get a text from her. You have a great conversation but she never replies back when you ask to see her sometime. Another victory for her. And another ego hit for you. She will continue doing this, showing up, calling or texting all at the oddest times as if she knows when you are almost over her. And each time you fall for it and it keeps your infatuation towards here always there under the surface. This will continue as long a as you let it. Just watch. If she wanted to be with you she would be. The fact she isn't means she's already decided there isn't anything left from your soul for her to take.

Unless you are a masochist with some cuckold fetish, you are going to end up feeling miserable, discarded like a piece of trash, invalidated, defeated, worthless, shunned and hopeless. That's because you were just played like a drum. Used. Sucked dry.  And the worse you are, the bigger heartbreaker she'll feel like.

You are playing with fire. You'll see. Soon enough.

THIS! So much this.  The part of her that once cared about you she took away and is for someone else possibly someone she just met that has an iq of 50.  That part of her you used to adore she gives freely away to strangers while she trash talks you to them. It is a horrible feeling and deep down you know it's true because you can already feel it.

[ReluctantSurvivor]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD. 

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

I need to have this framed and put on my wall.  Thank you.

[Infern0]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD. 

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

Why even bother? 

I mean yeah do all that stuff for you but no need to manipulate a person suffering from MENTAL ILLNESS just to "get back at them"

Just ignore them,  move on if you don't want anything to do with them. Don't bother trying to get "revenge" the world has ALREADY got revenge for you,  she's got a mental illness that means she's never going to have a genuine happy life.

I worry about the people on here sometimes,  I think we can get worse than them at times.

[anxiety5]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD.  

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

Why even bother?  

I mean yeah do all that stuff for you but no need to manipulate a person suffering from MENTAL ILLNESS just to "get back at them"

Just ignore them,  move on if you don't want anything to do with them. Don't bother trying to get "revenge" the world has ALREADY got revenge for you,  she's got a mental illness that means she's never going to have a genuine happy life.

I worry about the people on here sometimes,  I think we can get worse than them at times.

If you read my post, you will clearly see I'm not advocating for revenge. And if you read it in full you would clearly understand that my post is about harnessing the ANGER that is left when someone destroys you the way that it often goes. If there is one undeniable truth, all feelings: pain, agony, despair, grief, sadness, etc all funnel to ANGER eventually. I'm not advocating vengeance in the traditional sense. I'm advocating REDEMPTION. Harnessing all those negative emotions and channeling it to building a better you. And if she comes around again, it's your chance to prove you DID LEARN. By telling her hell no.

[camuse]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD. 

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

This isn't really a win at all, the only way to win is not to play.

I don't think this would even make her want you back anyway, they don't target strong, confident people in the first place.

You are still thinking of them as people you can communicate with, who think in some way similarly to us.

For sure harness your feelings and make something positive from them - many here have done that. But indifference is the goal, what your ex thinks is utterly irrelevant. They will never see you as a good catch or otherwise, everyone is either a suitable mark for supply or not.

[camuse]

Nothing and Nobody will convince you not to be friends with her. Come on guys, we all know that. How many times did we ignore our friends, our family, or just the look on their faces without saying anything yet screaming a look that said "this person is not right for you" We even ignore ourselves. That's why we are here.

That being said, this is really one of those situations where you have to touch the stove to realize it will burn you. No matter what we might say, you will not listen.

I was the exact same way. I even tricked myself into thinking I was somehow in control. Like I had the upper hand.

Your friendship will start off pretty hot. Intense. That's because she's a control freak and gets off on the fact she still has you sitting in her bed naked, yet has no obligation to you whatsoever. That is exciting to her. You take it as going smooth. You can have her back any day now, if you want her. What will happen is she will start doing things like disappearing after 5pm on a Saturday. Her phone will be turned off, and you won't have any way to reach her. All as you were in the middle of trading texts, and things seemed to be one step away from getting back together. Meanwhile, you've been keeping her company on texts as she gets ready for her night out with your replacement or some random person she just met. She will start lying to you because she feels no obligation to tell you the truth, and that alone is so disrespectful and something "Friends" don't do. You will inevitably either have your ego damaged by realizing you are her B or C option, or by the simple fact she lies to YOU in order to make time for SOMEONE ELSE. You will try to fight back, maybe shun her, etc. But you will soon realize she does.not.care. Once you act too clingy one time when she's onto someone else, you are gone. Once you criticize her once for her lying to you, you're gone. Then the major ego hit comes to you. When you realize, SHE COULD NOT POSSIBLY CARE ANY LESS that you are hurting. Intact, she thinks you are pathetic. She is doing stuff with other guys and you are stalking her Facebook or frantically texting her and she doesn't respond. Eventually you'll get fed up and pull away. You will be JUST getting to a point of stability and feeling better and you'll get a text from her. You have a great conversation but she never replies back when you ask to see her sometime. Another victory for her. And another ego hit for you. She will continue doing this, showing up, calling or texting all at the oddest times as if she knows when you are almost over her. And each time you fall for it and it keeps your infatuation towards here always there under the surface. This will continue as long a as you let it. Just watch. If she wanted to be with you she would be. The fact she isn't means she's already decided there isn't anything left from your soul for her to take.

Unless you are a masochist with some cuckold fetish, you are going to end up feeling miserable, discarded like a piece of trash, invalidated, defeated, worthless, shunned and hopeless. That's because you were just played like a drum. Used. Sucked dry.  And the worse you are, the bigger heartbreaker she'll feel like.

You are playing with fire. You'll see. Soon enough.

Brilliant post. Everyone considering being friends should read this. This is exactly what will happen. Don't do it to yourself.

[Blimblam]

I think this thread should be put in the lessons section. Lol

Too many posts on here that should be laminated and kept on the bathroom mirror to be read every morning while detaching.

[goldylamont]

ha ha ha ha. That would be great, except she'd probably buy a billboard and put a sign up with your picture so it was broadcast that you have an STD. 

The sad reality is, there is no way to win. For winning would mean you have a disorder yourself because their splitting, shunning, replacement and recycling are all things normal people don't do.

The best way to get back at her is to harness all your pain and go finish your degree. If you have your degree, get another one, if you have that get a freaking PHD. If you have a good job, work your tail off and get a promotion. Start working out. Run. Get in the best shape of your life. Volunteer, get your name and picture in the paper after you save 11 kittens from being put down by finding them homes. My point is, channel that negative energy into positive change for you. It's a win-win. You become healthier, more confident, happier, a better worker, or an advanced degree. You become a better version of you. Meanwhile these social status gold digging BPD types who are often times infatuated with arbitrary qualities like money, etc starts to realize they may have just dumped the cities most eligible bachelor. A guy who is getting a degree, promotions, doing things in his community, all the while being fit, and looking great. She will start to paint you white again. She will start to think she shouldn't have left. When she comes around again, she will try to get you under her control. She will say she misses you. This is the perfect scenario to say, Thanks. You know, I just want to thank you. Something lit a fire in me the way things went down with us, and I feel like I can conquer the World now. I feel like I can accomplish anything. And after we weren't together, I had the time to realize the only thing stopping me was me. So thank you.

This will eat her alive. It will make her want you.  Her fear that she made the wrong decision will turn to desperation to get you back. And this is your chance to tell her NO.

That's the best end game. It's a win-win, something dating her never once provided you.

Why even bother? 

I mean yeah do all that stuff for you but no need to manipulate a person suffering from MENTAL ILLNESS just to "get back at them"

Just ignore them,  move on if you don't want anything to do with them. Don't bother trying to get "revenge" the world has ALREADY got revenge for you,  she's got a mental illness that means she's never going to have a genuine happy life.

I worry about the people on here sometimes,  I think we can get worse than them at times.

anxiety5, i want to give you a high five followed by a beer :-)

Infern0 I disagree that becoming a better version of yourself, becoming more attractive and then if the opportunity arises, *thanking* your ex for helping you in this regard is great. Personally I think this is the best response I could think of saying if/when I run into my ex. And honestly, I could really care less about her feelings--I would absolutely not want to trigger her if I thought she was suicidal or would harm herself or others. But, seriously she's nutty and might feel jealous or indifferent or whatever regardless of what I do, I don't have any control over her emotions. Unless something I said would make her harm herself, then hell, she *should* be jealous. Man in my case that chick can't even try to act like she's better off now than she was with me--her new bf isn't 'better' by a long stretch, her living situation is worse, her behavior took a humongous nose dive after leaving. Her feeling jealous would be closer to the truth and actually would be a sign of accepting reality in my opinion. At some point, for some of us, i think it's perfectly healthy to not give a darn about petty emotions of our exes... .

Regarding getting revenge--in a way Infern0 do you think that perhaps you keeping in touch with your ex may have something to do with revenge? Perhaps against the replacement since he was such a douche waiting in the wings for your breakup? And by revenge here--aren't we simply talking about reclaiming our own power here? Reclaiming our own power for us, putting ourselves first without consideration for an abuser? It feels like in your situation, getting back together with your ex, perhaps trying to sleep with her again while maintaining a narcissistic level of detachment is a way for you to gain your power back... .without considering what would make her (or 'bilbo baggins' feel good? i could be wrong with this, but can you see anything i've brought up as being a factor in your current friendship?

[icecream]

Saying "yes" to a friendship with a pwBPD is giving them permission to:

-let her flirt online, start of immidiatly with someone else and show how happy she is on fb, kissing with replacement etc... .and they assume you "like" that... after all you are a friend

-if you are totally happy with friendship and nothing more, if you feel you can actually like when she is having a good time with others, without being jealous... .

-she doesnt have to explain why this or that she is doing

-she can leave every conversation without talking things through

-at moments when you start to realize you are okay with all of this... suddenly she start flirting with you again, or bringing up romantic past events between you two... .and then your heart starts to get warm suddenly... .you are still hooked, dreaming, hoping... .because she mentioned: you are her safetynet, you understand her so well... .

She must love you after all, thats what keeps popping in your mind.

Don't make any moves... .after all you are a friend who is not suppose to get hurt by all of her actions!

Up for that? Tried it 2 years and hell i wont sign for it again!

[Infared]

Friends?

Mine would just talk about the relationship that she left me for. That's right, the guy she was cheating on me with and ran off to a week before Christmas, after living with me for 5 years.

WHY would I want to be friends with this person? WHY are they soo self-centered that it is beyond comprehension?

HOW could I have the tiniest bit of self-esteem and want to interact with someone so self-involved and TOTALLY unaware of my feelings?

If you have been through what I have been through and you want to be friends with this creature... .please do yourself a favor... .befriend a therapist first.

Love you. 

[JB8888]

Weird... .I ran into my exBPDgf about 10 minutes ago. It's the second time in a couple weeks, the first she was hammered and very unsettled/unstable which is fine I guess seeing each other first time. This time she was nervous, but seemed quite normal. I wondered if I could be friends with her and essentially, sure - I wouldn't say friends but if I ran into her we could get a drink or something. But I'm not even interested. a) her capacity to devalue, hurt and disregard my feelings terrifies me - I would never risk or endure that again b) She talks on the surface of things OR gets wasted and gets very deep but has idealised opinions of who and how she is to the point my mouth drops because she's none of those things c) she takes takes takes and yes the conversation is centred on her or something that has nothing to do with anything.

Since our breakup 6 months ago I really worked on myself and realised how emotionally rich my life was without her. I went back to my friends (I did isolate when in a r/s with her as she feared my mates - many were onto her). They were supportive and helped me through my pain. Very quickly I realised how much love, genuine interest, shared common goals, shared emotional intelligence I have around me. And how loved and appreciated I am vs. being constantly devalued. There is no more drama! And it's peaceful. And I choose no more drama. There is no fat in my life anymore - and she is the only person in my life who doesn't really know how to be my friend. Her friends are split black every month. She hasn't asked for friendship yet, but I know she will at some point. But she will engage when she wants something, money, access to fun things etc. Looking back I have always been her emotional crutch. I have never been a conscious choice based on anything other than what i can provide and being her "home". And I have always been recycled when she's spun out of control.

Friendship is an exchange and I don't think it's possible to have that consistently. You will get it now and then, but for them to feel better about themselves. Not to just be there for you out of the kindness of their heart. And as soon as replacement comes along, she'll lie and be gone. I watched her do it when I was the replacement. I watched her lie to her friends about where she was. I had her fall off the radar plenty of times.

I don't feel anything. And that's so weird considering I have feared running into her for months and feared my own reaction. Having read this forum it's helped so much to keep my brain on during conversations. To almost just watch her... .She's the same, and still the same 6 years later. Same drama, same blaming other people, same new boss struggling with her. You need to ask yourself why would you be friends with her? What would be the exchange? I'm not missing out on anything - she is. But she made her bed and as they say "I've found the key to happiness. Stay away from idiots". You will lose this battle mate... .the only way to win is to look out for number one and surround yourself with good, kind people. I am best friends with two of my exes (I only have 2 others) and they are beautiful solid friendships. I won't have that with her and if there is any sadness there, it is that realisation. But I can't be who I really am with her. And I pick being me over compromising myself, as the only beneficiary of being friends with her, is her getting some of me. Why do it to yourself? Try it - you clearly have it in you for a last gasp, but if you do keep it distant. But then again, what's the point of that? It's not even real.

[shellbent]

I tried being friends with my ex, she said we could be. However anytime I try ro spend time with her or talk to her she makes excuses. She never initiated ever. Also when I do run into her, she seems nervous or anxious. I could handle hearing things about her life without me, but it is a thousand times worse this way. I don't know how to be her friend, she never says anything unless I ask, and even then she is secretive. So maybe she doesn't want tocause me more pain, I don't know. Anyone have any thoughts on why she is acting this way?

[christoff522]

My experience is it's heartbreak for us, and is simply a situation of them knowing how we feel and keep us at arms length whilst having someone "there for them".

However you can NEVER say you love them, or express any romantic interest without being treated like a naughty toddler.

Don't expect to hang out, just expect to be a saviour whenever she requires it.

When you're at this point, grieve and move on. If theres any chance of salvaging your self-respect thats the only way of doing it.

Part of the issue is that when you're in contact you get weaker and weaker, the BPD sees this and loses respect for you.

If you go NC and move on, if they see you again, they've missed you, they see you're different, they begin to be attracted. Then you get to tell them to take a running jump, or words to that effect.

[In Pain]

I understand all you are saying. And unfortunately agree.

While trying to be friends,  she will most likely say how her new BF treats her so much better than you did, is so much nicer etc.

It you say you are seeing someone now as well... .What effect does this have ?

Jealousy, rage, indifference... .?

I suppose if you are just making it up, they can see through you... .If you really are seeing someone  else, and you sleep with the ex, it makes you no better than them !

[camuse]

Take a look at their other friends - mine had NONE in our city, but raved about her amazing old college mates. But none of them ever bothered to come see her. I met them once, they were just enablers who liked to take drugs with her, and guys hanging round waiting for their turn on her. And she slagged them off behind their backs. They weren't friendly to me. She hated my many friends, mainly the female ones, but didn't like any of them taking my time away from her.

Does your ex have proper friends - people she would help out with anything at the drop of a hat? Or are they just people who are useful to her her?

Mine sometimes asked "What does <insert friend name> bring into your life?" I tried explaining I dont pick my mates according to what I can get out of them, but she didn't get the concept.

They don't really have real friends imo because friendship is a two way process, and they are very much one way people.

[christoff522]

Take a look at their other friends - mine had NONE in our city, but raved about her amazing old college mates. But none of them ever bothered to come see her. I met them once, they were just enablers who liked to take drugs with her, and guys hanging round waiting for their turn on her. And she slagged them off behind their backs. They weren't friendly to me. She hated my many friends, mainly the female ones, but didn't like any of them taking my time away from her.

So true, I guess the only people there for her are her family.

Mine has old school friends, usually guys (they always say "I get on so much better with guys", I'm pretty sure they just wait for their chance, usually ply her with vodka, but most of the males come and go, she always has new guys appearing liking her stuff.

One of her friends apparently slept with her ex. But all her close friends are enablers.

Does your ex have proper friends - people she would help out with anything at the drop of a hat? Or are they just people who are useful to her her?

This I can never be sure of. Would she do anything for them, perhaps only to look good.

Mine sometimes asked "What does <insert friend name> bring into your life?" I tried explaining I dont pick my mates according to what I can get out of them, but she didn't get the concept.

They really don't get this idea, its always facilitation, rather than a sort of homeostasis of emotion and time spent together.

They don't really have real friends imo because friendship is a two way process, and they are very much one way people.

I don't even see it as that, friendship is just, a thing... you care about one another, thats it.

[Mr Hollande]

I understand that my ex had hopes for us being "friends" after the split. Since she so gleefully stomped all over my feelings and sh#t on our 5 years together withholding my friendship was perhaps the last thing I had to hit her back with. Letting her be my friend after what she did would be like kissing the foot that had just kicked me in the face and there is no chance I'd ever do that. I was stupid and weak for 5 years but I've at least managed to retain a shred of dignity by denying her all access to my life from here on.

[Infared]

I understand that my ex had hopes for us being "friends" after the split. Since she so gleefully stomped all over my feelings and sh#t on our 5 years together withholding my friendship was perhaps the last thing I had to hit her back with. Letting her be my friend after what she did would be like kissing the foot that had just kicked me in the face and there is no chance I'd ever do that. I was stupid and weak for 5 years but I've at least managed to retain a shred of dignity by denying her all access to my life from here on.

I have gotten a "little" less angry about it... .but yes... .for me... .that too... .I just can't be friends with someone that treated me so vilely. Not only because "my" self-esteem just can't go there now that my head AND my heart know the truth... .but also because being friends with this person also validates their behavior, big-time.  I would be giving the message: "Yes... you cheated on me, you demeaned me, you were cruel and enjoyed watching me in pain... .you lied to everyone: me, him, your Mom, your Dad, your best friend, your step Mom... your step Dad... .EVERYONE... .and that is ok... no big deal... that behavior is just fine and you should go out and do it again whenever you feel it is necessary because, hey, there just aren't any consequences. Its a WIN/WIN for you." I cannot give that message.

... but getting real... .I don't think not being friends with them will change their behavior at all, most likely.  We are talking about serious mental illness here.

[JB8888]

I agree with infared and Mr. Hollande. Withholding friendship is about the only thing we can do to a) maintain our dignity and b) reiterate that there are consequences to their actions. Being friends or even just simply being there to pick up the pieces only reassures them they can act like the devil and get away with it. It doesn't work like that in our normal friendships... .so how come they get to be the exception? Because the sex was good? Pfff... .had great sex with nons too.

I've learned I can be civil and detached with my ex as we have mutual friends (well, acquaintances - my friends even struggle to be civil with her). But that's as close as she's getting and frankly not having that tension makes my life easier as I hate bad vibes/energy. She thinks she'll end up like how I am with my other exes but she's deluded. They treated me with honesty and respect and kindness always even throughout our breakups. This one went too far... .and call it punishment, maybe it is, but basically i'm not interested in engaging with unhealthy/unstable people. I was about to say "unpredictable" but having read these boards and seeing my ex, she is definitely predictable and if I let her in she will fire missiles at me again for sure. She can't help herself.