Liz graduated and is coming home

[John Galt]

Well my friends,

Wife just called and told me that there was a meeting at her group with all the participants and clinicians and Doctors and she is coming home on Friday for good !

Last night she called and asked me my opinion of her coming home after the meeting tomorrow ( today) with the clinicians.

I told her that I want her home yet only if the clinicians and her all think that she has completed everything that she needs to complete.I told her I supported her either way in staying or coming home,and the decision was theirs and hers, not mine.

She just called me and said that she will graduate on Friday at 2 pm ! They felt that she had learned all she can there.There is a support system in place with a weekly meeting 15 minutes away from our home and Wife wants to go.Other stuff we will discuss later in terms of support and the future plans re: therapy.

For the record I always anticipated the chance that maybe she would attempt to get kicked out ( very easy if desired) and I also wondered if this was a ploy when she spoke of early graduation but I assure all my friends here who support me and supported me  that this is the real deal here !


Kudos for Wife, the kids and me. Being a little Ruthless helps !

Thanks to all for the unwavering support.

M

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[eternaloptimist]

Congratulations!  You deserve a fabulous homecoming - you give us hope.

[John Galt]

Thank you so much,and I think I will steal your name and re name my self ''eternal optimist '' !

[SadButHoping]

Great news, Marc.

I'll keep 2 on Friday on my calendar for good thoughts heading out for you and your family.  I hope the reunion is everything you want it to be.

SBH

[John Galt]

Thank you very much and I will get a dozen roses for Liz and greet her with the all the kids togeather .Forgetting about BPD for this next thought , I am a man who has always understood the very very hard job of staying home with the kids and raising them and the household.I have always seen this as harder than going out and making money,but I proclaim to all the stay at home moms and dads in the Universe that this last 9 weeks has taught me that it is way more difficult than I ever thought,and I will be more thoughtful in the future when sometimes I have not been.

And I have my mom, and a full time cleaning lady as well in the last 9 weeks !

[spamlady]

Ruthie,

This is soo good! Really, couldn't be better. Knowing where this started--how profoundly ill she was--gives me great hope for all of us.

And major kudos to the catalyst--Babe Ruth--for hitting this one outta the park!

Beaming,

spam

PS: Roses for your mom, too--from you AND Liz.

[John Galt]

Thanks munchkin !

She still is ill though, this is a start ,not anywhere near an end.Please understand this.This is a beginning of a long long road and she has completed the ending of the beginning,thats all.

It is huge and serious and amazing.

She now must apply what she has learned,thats the real test.The intimacy issues of the BPD.

Today though is only kudos day !

Hank Aaron 755

Bonds 720?

Ruth 714

Baby Ruth 1

Marc

[eternaloptimist]

You mustn't rename yourself - ruthless is what got you where you are now - We all need a bit less ruth in our lives!

[elphaba]

Oh, Marc

I am so happy for you and your family this will be a long road, but you are all now on the right road, the right path to healing and happiness.

congrats!

[crystal]

Marc,

I still feel relativley new to bpdfamily, but you are truly an inspiration! 

You set an example of how to be kind and yet set boundaries. How to use love, not abuse it.   How to be optimistic and practical at the same time.

All the best to you! 

-Crystal

[John Galt]

Thank you so much Elph and Crystal.

The day of change came when I was kind to me and the kids and ruthless to Liz though.

Marc

[JoannaK]

Marc, I'm so glad she is graduating early, and all of my hopes and prayers are with you, Liz, and your kids. 

Yep, being a stay-at-home mom is hard.  I was exhausted day in and day out when mine was a toddler and into everything... .

[At Bay]

Marc,

I'm so glad to know your family has grown in understanding, and put forth effort to be there for each other and trust one another with the truth. Sometimes things do work out all right. Someone (you), had to say the old ways are intolerable and wrong. Your kids learned to have faith in their abilities by your example. Liz received a chance to show them she can believe that, too. I can't say enough good things.

At Bay

[Golden Silence]

Amongst all the pain and bitterness of bpdfamily, you and your family are an inspiration and glimmer of hope for those who still have the opportunity to be committed.

I'm so happy for you and yours Marc.

Heartfelt Congratulations 

[supermom]

Oh Marc, I'm so happy for Liz, your children, and yourself!  My best wishes to all!  Such wonderful, positive news. 

[NewLifeforHGG]

YAY! Now you can bring the family down south for some good ole bbq ribs and sweet tea!

Happy for your new start.

[Mollyd]

Marc,

I am thrilled for you, Liz, and your kids.  IMO you have done absolutely everything you could have done to try to honor your committment to your wife and your kids.  Personal therapy, intervention for your kids and treatment for Liz.  What more could you do (except maybe put Em back up and lose Shakira?  Oh -wait - that's not related!)? 

You know, I see recovery as a life-long process.  While I am thrilled, and believe you guys deserve to seriously celebrate - being all Molly and all - I also hold a dose of caution.

Many, many, many people go thru treatment of one sort or another.  It is a serious accomplishment.  But, at the end of the day a month, year, decade from now - it will not be about whether Liz completed treatment or not.  It will be about what she takes with her. 

With celebration - also, I believe your boundaries now will need to be even stronger, your resolve even more clearly stated, and your tenacity (which I don't think you could ramp down if you tried) ever present.

Know I support you and yours.

Molls.

[John Galt]

Thanks guys and dolls !

It is very true and I keep telling those here that this is a beginning, not an end.From here on in we will still have to fight the fight with love and boundries.

I spoke last night with the head of the BPD clinic here in Toronto.It was a real chance meeting at a fundraiser for something unrelated to BPD.Anyway we spoke for a little and I asked him what I needed to know about BPD and if in his opinion if there was any chance for these people.

He laughed slightly at the question and answered ''of course there is''.He claimes that there is much supporting evidence now that there is a burnout almost of some behaviours( I know this sounds a little old school) and much evidence CURRENTLY supports this,and how it can dye down late 30s and early 40s. I asked him what else I need to know and he said the only thing that is certain is that if anyone tells you they know about BPD for sure,then just to totally disregard that person !

It was an interesting conversation to say the least.

Thanks for the well wishes,

Molly, note Shakira has gone home and M returned ! I just felt like looking at Shakira yesterday !

Marc

[spamlady]

Hello my fellow Bama fan,

You sound like you have prepared the perfect thing to wear for the homecoming barbeque--a chef's blend of celebration and caution (celecaution).

That's interesting about the research, but remember that all stats come from averages--what "most" people with BPD do. Keeping in mind that "most" people with BPD would never do what your brave wife did, I think you two have a big leg up on this thing. I'm so glad to hear you say that you know it'll be an ongoing process, though--there will undoubtedly be good periods and bad, but you're now prepared to deal appropriately with both. I'm so happy for the entire Ruth family.

That Shakira pic had me all mixed up. I knew it was you talking on your posts, but I kept hearing your words in a female voice. Glad you're back to M.

spam

[John Galt]

 I like the metaphore !


Hey , so I like hot Latinas ,what can I say ?

Thanks Spamy

[optimistic]

Marc -- best wishes to you and your family.  While it is important to be cautious, etc., I believe that every step forward deserves a celebration. Thank you for sharing your process and your thoughts so willingly - it helps all of us who are committed.

[Oy-vey!]

Marc,

Mazel tov to you and Liz and your kids!  May this new beginning bring much happiness to you all!

[been there]

   HI marc,

   Congradulations to Liz, and wishing you all the best. Small steps in the right direction.

   Don't want to rain on your parade, but to encourage you to remember these small steps forward, when there is a setback. This is a long and hard road for everyone involved, and at least in Tina and my relationship there were setbacks along the way. For us, the journey was worth it, and I hope it ends that way for you and Liz too.

   Take care, Mark

[Caribou]

Congratulations to you, Marc, and your whole family.  What an accomplishment!

Yesterday I was thinking about how difficult it would be for any of our spouses to commit 12 weeks to a program like this.  The ones that have jobs have to take off that amount time and the ones with families have to make other arrangements.  Then factor in the difficulty of making the admission that you have problems large enough to warrant going to a program like that; not to mention the difficult personal work required once you are in the program.  It is no wonder that the success rate of recovery from BPD is so low.

On the flip side, If someone overcomes all of those obstacles and finishes the program, they deserve major kudos.

[spamlady]

Ruthie,

Sending all good wishes your way for the graduation and the homecoming. Liz deserves so much credit, and so do you.

Congratulations!

spam

[John Galt]

Thank you so much recent guys and dolls.


Yes , there will be a setback ,many. I am more prepared for these now cause I have learned many do's and don't s'.

First do  is to understand ourselves first !

Bada Bing !

Marc

[Ashlynn]

Marc,

I am thrilled that Liz is doing so well that she is graduating early!  Take her out for a beautiful romantic dinner this weekend and celebrate! 

Your story continues to be an inspiration for those of us who are working with our loved ones for recovery, and your resolve and strength are an example to us all.

Anna

[JerryZ]

AWESOME, ruthless.

Bless,

Jerry

[John Galt]

Thanks guys !

The thing about Liz is that she is really wanting to do certain things in the house that have been neglected.The house, also spending quality time with the kids, knowing that this time she is not leaving on Monday.She is wanting me to relax as well and just do whatever I want ( within reason !)

This weekend was beautiful and relaxing .There was a minor conflict between my 9 year old and her at one point and it escalated a little, and my usually strategy would be intervention yet I sat back and observed and Liz handled it very well.

Today ( Canada Day) I came to work to catch up a little ,and Liz would usually get upset , but she was great , and actually just called me from a walk with the kids !  This would never happen before. She sounded great and has called me twice today,which is usually around 158 times less than usual !

One thing as well is this program has a 3 month support group starting mid July that Liz wants to go to on a week night. her call, not mine, and its great !


Thanks friends,

Marc

[Silent Alarm]

Marc, I haven't posted much lately, but I've been following your thread on a weekly basis.

Congratulations, I'm very happy for you and your family.  Keep up the good work!

[John Galt]

Thank you very much SA !

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[WhiteBuffalow]

Congratulations! You all have worked so hard to get through this! I know there is more to go, but you are doing such an excellent job and your wife major really seems to be trying to get through this ugly disorder!

Please give her a silent hug from all of us! So few are willing to face this demon the way she has and I pray the very best for all of you!

You all may very well be one of the biggest success stories out of this! Something to give inspiration to both sides of this disorder.

Bless you all!

[John Galt]

Thank you DT,

Liz has faced the demon so to speak but the funny(?) thing is is that she has still not accepted the BPD vis a vis her issue.She agrees to the depression and is working on that, and her behaviours which are magnificent to say the least.

I do not talk to her about BPD and this is what many say on these boards, deal with the behaviours.

When I look at others here ie Caribou and his wife maybe being BPD, yet the doctors say no, then it makes me wonder about the actual label of BPD .I found it very difficult to drop my stance on the idea of Liz accepting her BPD, yet I must add that her dealing with the behaviours are way more fulfilling that putting an exact name to the dx.

My therapist keeps insisting that it is something that she might never acknowledge although if she works on the  rages, spending, impulsivity, etc that is the real issue.

This was the 3rd amazing weekend in a row for us, the kids seem way better , there are no arguements at all, Liz gets up early , she insists on me doing things for myself, she is cleaning the basement and actually throwing tons of stuff out.

Yesterday , I was cleaning our garage and I see some strollers and car seats etc which we have not used for a few years , so I put out a bunch of things at the front lawn and I put up a sign and wrote ''free'', and then I asked Liz is she would really mind getting rid of this stuff to which she replied ''oh, great, we do not need it''.It was good because she is a huge pat rack and this was another real good step.

There is a follow up to her program BTW, which is a weekly meeting starting next week for 3 months , one night to which she wants to go.

Marc

[eternaloptimist]

The stigma of the BPD label is so great, at least for mine, that - that I don't care what they call it - they could call it wonderland - as long as they accept that something is wrong and accpet the power to change the behavior.  Marc - Take advantage of these wonderful weekends - you've earned them!

[Mollyd]

Marc,

I think that Liz has had a smooth adjustment returning home is pretty awesome and remarkable.  I agree you guys deserve to celebrate the hard work you've ALL done to address her condition.  I hope her adjustment continues to go this well.

Now - I know I'm a minority voice in what I'm about to say.

For Liz - I really believe we cannot truly change/address/heal what we do not acknowledge.  So, if my spouse (he did do this actually) claims depression, and anxiety - but does not fully accept his condition of alcoholism - this puts HIM at risk.  He, as Liz, needs to protect himself from the triggers related specifically to alcoholism - and if he is only holding vigilance against depression and anxiety, his risk to repeat alcholic patterns or thinking and behavior increase dramatically.  So, I really get why you are concerned about this.  I share your concern, despite what professionals say.

However, it is not for you to get Liz to accept or not her condition.  She takes this risk herself, by engaging in denial, it's her risk and her right.  It is possible she can correct behaviors/thinking to the same extent whether she really accepts or not.  Possible, but the risks increase with her denial, imo.

The thing I do think is for YOU is the reality of living with someone who is unwilling or incapable of seeing themselves for real/accurately.  I suppose this could impact your kids too - not being able to say blue is blue - so to speak.  However, if you and your kids can do this - and it all works, then it does.  I empathize with your struggle in this - ultimately everyone is doing well now - and THIS IS GOOD.

But, I hear ya, and I think it would bother me too, as it would be harder for me to trust the change is real if there is continued "denial" going on.  Time WILL tell - don't worry.

Molls.

[John Galt]

I hear you and agree yet if the behaviours are great,and Liszy continues to go to her meetings and when they finish she still does work then that will be fine for me.It took her 18 years to get here and has actually been working on it for 3 months so all in due course.

If Liszy regresses then I will push the issue, if not then thats fine.

She has been very open about the criteria she does have, she just does not know the whole 5/9 thing but does work on her issues.


hmmm

Wonderland Personality Disorder , I like that EO !

Marc

[spamlady]

Hi ruthie,

I agree with molls that you should be vigilant for denial and its possible effects on her behavior and on your family.

However, you can't argue with success, and as long as things continue to go well -- with her actively working to keep herself in a healthy place -- you can just sit back and bask in the beauty of it all! 8)

I'm so jealous happy for you.

Hugs,

spam

[John Galt]

Lets have fun and not show Molly how to do this !

Well, my therapist said that if you walked into a hospital with Liz and she had red dots all over her leg and the doctor gave her something to get rid of it, but he did not know the dx, then what would I think ?

Now of course the difference is is that I thing acceptance is part of the cure, and this is the struggle, but BPD can't be saved in a day, I guess.


Marc

[spamlady]

Lets have fun and not show Molly how to do this !

No, let's just make S the default setting on bpdfamily so we'll have to click something special to get it to NOT S!

But she is accepting that she has a problem and is willing to work to try to fix it. The only problem is in the specific label. I'm so hoping for you.

spam 8)

[John Galt]

I know you are baby cakes, and I thank you.

[Mollyd]

Well, now I know who my friends REALLY are!

Hmmmmpf!

At least Caribou's nice to me!

Molls.(stomping away) 

[John Galt]

On a serious note here Molly, I for one on behalf of all committed want to thank you for coming over to give us the ''unchosen'' perspective.Any unchosen who spends time on this part of the boards really deserves so much thanks from all of us. I have said since my first post on unchosen way way back where I tried to understand my childrens thoughts through the eyes of those wise people, that the unchosens have so much to offer us , and I thank them all.

Sometimes we can only see where we are ,yet they seem to have the knack of knowing where our children can be, when we remain status quo .That was their greatest gift to me, the true heroism of showing me what my kids will endure by staying status quo.

marc

[seeking solace]

Hi... I'm new to bpdfamily and I just wanted to say that it's hopeful AND realistic views like this that warm my heart. Life is full of ups and downs, good times and hard times... while you're being realistic about the future I'm glad to see you're taking the time to celebrate the wonderful moments too! This journey would be much to difficult if we didn't embrace the good times. Thanks for being here and shining a light of hope.

ss

[John Galt]

Thanks Solace, very much.

I came to bpdfamily a while back for me, but I stay today for you !

Marc