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 1 
 on: June 01, 2024, 07:26:55 AM  
Started by Stephen1999 - Last post by EyesUp
American here.  Not an atty.  

That said…

Courts don’t have time or interest to explore personality or psychology.  They always deal with conflict, so nothing about your situation will seem unusual.

You need to focus on the law.

Was anything in your messages illegal?  Threatening?

Do you have any evidence that anything she did or said to you in those prior months was illegal or threatening?  I mean real, admissible evidence.  Any witnesses?

If there is no evidence, then what is the basis for her claim?

What are the charges you’re facing?  What is the outcome you’re hoping for?

Do you have an atty?

Assuming that you do, here are some things to explore:

Depose your ex, get her to acknowledge the history you mention here under oath.  Then present in court.  Watch her get tangled in her own story.

Do you know your ex’s triggers?  Review with your atty.  A good litigator will know how to get your ex to expose herself while in court.  I bet she’s prone to tantrums - help her have one in court…

The idea is to avoid making unsubstantiated claims, ie “she’s got a PD and is mentally unstable” - this is opinion, not fact, hard to prove, and therefore not helpful to your case.  Forget about this. 

Instead, get her to demonstrate her behavior to the court on her own….  Show the court who is reasonable and who is not.

Then politely apologize to the judge or magistrate for wasting their time with your unfortunate but not-unlawful situation, and ask for permission to go your separate ways...

Make sense?

 2 
 on: June 01, 2024, 07:12:58 AM  
Started by Q1977 - Last post by EyesUp
This article re “no contact” might be a good reference…

https://bpdfamily.com/content/no-contact-right-way-wrong-way

I know it’s a cliche, but…. When one door closes, another opens.  Look forward.  If you find yourself ruminating and looking back, change the channel in your head.  Read, listen, watch, eat, run, walk, swim, sleep - anything to break the repetition.  Like anything else, it’s a habit.  Habits can be broken.

It’s good you’re working with a psychologist - what do they have to say so far about your question?

 3 
 on: June 01, 2024, 07:05:27 AM  
Started by Bran - Last post by EyesUp
If she maintains visible contacts with your friends, you’re not in a no contact situation.

If she has narcissistic traits, perhaps her intention is to make your friends become her friends?   Or merely not your friends?  It’s the predictable resentment response.  Does she resent you for some reason (real or imagined)?

Yes, there’s a good chance you’ll get recycled - very common.

The question is:  why do you want to revisit and continue this?  Do you feel that there is a chance for a healthy relationship here?


 4 
 on: June 01, 2024, 06:58:10 AM  
Started by Duluoz - Last post by EyesUp
Closure typically is something we have to Gift ourselves... Let Go and Move On.

This. 

And it applies to much more than breakups with disordered “partners”…. 

 5 
 on: June 01, 2024, 04:58:56 AM  
Started by HoratioX - Last post by Kashi
CPTSD is a different beast.   You have to get the whole family in to know what happened.

I know CPTSD very well. 

I have gone through my trauma and what makes me different that BPD.  Over it, through and all over it.

What makes me different when I endured, sexual abuse, a violent father, a mother who abandoned me.

There was no intermittent reinforcement of love in my life.  That is the difference I see. 

Where with my BPD ex there was, to the extreme.   Love when pleasing, then none.

I just didn't get any.   I am able to have nurturing feelings, kindness, empathy.   Where did that come from?

I wasn't shown values, so I made them up.  Yup.  I made them up.  I made up a code to live by.  One that said you are strong if you don't lie. You face the consequences and it's better to do that than lie.  You tell the truth to yourself even if it isn't great.  You are not the sum of your past experiences unless you make it so.  Your work is to slowly make yourself a better person. 

There are some things that trip me up.  For example, in my mind, I feel I am not supposed to be happy.  If show it someone will hurt me.   Because that is what happened to me.  So, I practice allowing myself and the world won't implode on me if I show I am happy. 

I think what has happened to them is they were handed a FIRM blueprint, where I wasn't. 

The blueprint for me was I was not worthy of love the same as theirs.  But I grew to believe in myself in an honest way.

Shame I allowed this person to abuse me emotionally.  The intricate design of the abuse I didn't recognize.

But they do.  They are replaying it just like a blueprint.  It's like a map in their minds that says this is how you operate. Nothing gets them out of that.   

Intermittent reinforcement is what they play out.  I believe that is how they were treated as a baby.

They were given the blueprint at the start.   They didn't have a chance.  The brains developed with that code.

I had something very different.  For example, my father was violent but never to me.  To me he told me in many ways, even though you are a girl, be your own person.  You can do anything.  I will show you and allow you to help me build and learn. He never sexually abused me.  I didn't need to please him or my mother.  My mother was being abused and she needed me for emotional support.  She also told me I was stupid and would never amount to anything and abandoned me.

That was the way it was.   Clear cut.  I knew if he walked in that door drunk, what was going to happen.

My ex her life was one of subversive bullying from both parents.  She was told what pleased and what didn't, and it was random.  She was told who she had to be to please her mother.  She was shown her father she meant nothing, then he was a sweet kind man.  Who isn't. 

CPTSD BIG difference in how it played out.









 6 
 on: June 01, 2024, 04:24:41 AM  
Started by zachira - Last post by Notwendy
When this group thing happened, I didn't realize it. People who I assumed were my friends suddenly were getting together without me. I asked one of them what was going on and she told me that this person ( the one with the suspected PD) doesn't like you, so at least she was honest. I was upset and sad over this and didn't understand  what was going on. I found out later that this person had done similar things to other people. She moved out of town but by then, friendships were ruined. It was a group of three women. The remaining two are still close friends. I am cordial when around them but keep a distance from them.

I have felt a bit envious of friends who have "girl groups" that they do things with but also now wonder how much of these involve drama that I am not interested in. I prefer to get together one on one with people or a group like neighbors if we get together on a back porch or doing something like a work out group. But some of my friends would do "girls night out" and things like that and I just didn't feel a fit with this situation.

After the situation with this group of women, I got busy with kids and doing things related to school and their activities. Admittedly, I didn't make the effort to socialize as much. I had a friend at work who I thought we were good friends but she left for another job and just cut off everyone related to the old job, including me. That felt hurtful but I don't think it was personal but about her not wanting memories of a job she didn't like. Still, I don't understand just discarding friends like that.


 7 
 on: June 01, 2024, 04:12:15 AM  
Started by Mad Dog - Last post by Notwendy
The rages serve a function for the pwBPD. PwBPD have difficulty managing uncomfortable feelings. Projection is one way they manage this. They don't perceive them as their own feelings- they must be coming from something outside them- and so may project them onto the people closest to them.

I compare the rages to when a child eats too many sweets, gets a stomach ache and throws up. The child then feels better and goes off to play.

I see rages as "throwing up" emotions. Once they are over, the pwBPD feels better and so assumes you must be feeling better too and goes about their way as if nothing happened.

Of course, it doesn't feel that way to you. ( or whoever they raged at). I don't think we have to tolerate being raged at, and so it is appropriate that you disengage when it happens. I wonder though, if it's necessary for you to remain that way for several days after. If this is what you need for your own self care- then that is what you need to do. If you are trying to "send her the message" or this is some kind of "silent treatment" then it may just extend the drama.

From my own experience ( with a BPD mother) - going back- trying to discuss the situation or hold her accountable for her behavior or even ask why is useless and often just results in another angry episode. It's difficult if we are seeking resolution but for her, once the feelings are "out" it's over for her and one goes on as if nothing happened. It's gone for her and her expectation is that you act as if nothing happened either and there's no special way to re-engage- you just interact as usual.

The less I assume her behavior is personal, the less I react emotionally to this kind of behavior.  It's just the way she is.


 8 
 on: June 01, 2024, 04:11:53 AM  
Started by Kashi - Last post by Kashi
She worked herself into my house under an arrangement and then she stayed.  She made it seem so horrible I was asking her to find her own place and I gave in.

I told her she had to work.  I don't think she liked that, but she did it.  That was a boundary at least.

I wasn't paying for someone else.  No way.  She ended up earning more money than me then accused me of being with her for her money. 

She accused me of just wanting sex.  But I felt I had to perform, and she raised the bar all the time.  Nobody can keep that up. 

Saying no was not an option if you didn't want to deal with the fall out. 

I think she picked me because I was a push over in her eyes.  I noticed the next person she picked she selected someone she had "power" over. 

I had boundaries but she wore them down.  Now I feel I have none. 

I hear the conversations about male violence, and I know that is problem.  Men need to nurture better men.  Men should stand up and be vocal when they see violence against women.  Acknowledge the physical power men have.  But also, men should be heard when they are saying they have been sexually abused, or emotionally and sometimes physically.  Not to make excuses for male violence problems in the world so it's a competition, but simply factual.  This happens to boys and men, not just women and girls.

Men have a right to take their emotional power back, just like women.

I am gay by the way.  I just see it so clearly now.  It's not a gender battle.   It's a battle of abuse. 

One way I guess is if men start to think they don't play a role as such, in a relationship.   The role is equal ALWAYS.  You might be stronger, or better at different things but there are areas that gender does stop either sex from performing a role of equality.  If you don't feel that equality no matter what gender you are, there is something wrong. 

Love always tries to equalize















 9 
 on: June 01, 2024, 01:23:36 AM  
Started by Q1977 - Last post by Tangled mangled
Hi, I'm currently seeking a psychologist regarding my mental health. I'm in a relationship with someone who was BPD tendencies and I'm trying to break this off and leave. My self esteem has been destroyed, I once managed to leave years ago but was manipulated and found myself dragged back into it. I freeze and feel paralysed at trying to speak and get the words out that we need to separate. Has anyone else felt like this? How did they get through it? How did they break it off. I read other articles that talk about people who have already left but nothing about the act itself. Last time I just took off without a word, I couldn't take it anymore and she followed me. I don't think I could do that to her again but for both our sakes we need to end this.


Sounds like you don’t have children involved.
What you did the first time, leaving without explanations would be my preferred choice if I was in your shoes. I’m female going through divorce and can remember being in the state you currently are in rn.
It may sound cowardly and appears immature but ask yourself this one question what did you ever gain from explaining and over explaining your decisions/choices/ actions/ POV to your pwbpd. All that does is give her all the power and control in the relationship. Remember that the end of the relationship would be as chaotic as the relationship itself no matter what you do. Going away quietly would be more effective, costing less emotional stress, and energy.
Explaining is enabling, she was able to convince you to comeback because she had access to you still. I’m sure she’s continued to blame you for leaving previously that’s why you feel it’s wrong to leave same way as you did then. What you did then was effective and this time I would add an extra layer of no access to communication or limited access through email.
Take care and I wish you all the best.


 10 
 on: May 31, 2024, 11:07:27 PM  
Started by HoratioX - Last post by HoratioX
Diagnosing BPD in individuals under age 18 used to be controversial, but that's changed. Diagnosis in adolescents was codified in DSM-V.

In case you might find Dr. Marsha Linehan's story of interest, here's a NYTimes article discussing it. https://archive.ph/EbeNI

Traditional psychoanalysis can actually be detrimental with BPD patients.
Short excerpts from a couple articles:

"The patients that Dr. Stern was seeing appeared neurotic – with intact reality testing – on their first interview, but when they were put on the couch they got worse. Their lives unraveled and they became self-destructive as they were unable to grapple with the intense emotions that psychoanalysis brought up."

"So the prescription was classical psychoanalysis, calling for the patient to free associate while lying on the couch. "At first, she was friendly and cooperative, always on time and eager to talk about herself," Oldham recalled. "She engaged in the treatment and seemed to be benefitting from it."
A couple of months into treatment, however, the patient made an announcement. "She said to me, ‘Here I am doing just what I've always done. I blithely rush into a relationship without even thinking about it, and I don't know you at all. How do I know I can trust you?’"
She began to demand of Oldham information about himself and about his training and blamed him for what she perceived as a treatment that wasn't working. "She became convinced I was keeping secrets from her and told me the problem was that I had been trained in a ‘fly-by-night’ school," he said. "In time, she would become absolutely enraged at me, regardless of what I said. And when I didn't give her an answer she wanted, it became proof that once again she had landed in the clutches of someone who was another disappointment and who might actually harm her."
The treatment and what had appeared to be a promising therapeutic relationship ended abruptly when the patient relocated to another part of the country. For Oldham the case remains an object lesson in how not to treat a patient with BPD.
"Under no circumstances would I treat her today with psychoanalysis," Oldham said."


That's part of what I think happened with my ex. The NPD guy she's now seeing initially offered to act as her therapist (though he has absolutely no training as a therapist). They proceeded with free-association psychoanalysis, and she deteriorated. Then they began their affair. Her BPD symptoms are now far worse than in the years we were together. She believes that her "therapy" with this guy uncovered repressed material that had always been there and needed to be worked on, but the reality is that the pseudotherapy really f*cked her up. And she often does recognize that she's pretty psychologically messed up now. I did subsequently manage to engage her into proper DBT therapy (at a center that works predominantly with pwBPD), but she resisted the DBT therapy and wouldn't do the homework, and then dropped out.
I'm curious -- is the treatment for CPTSD similar? Generalized anxiety?  Do they approach treatment from a shared perspective or so a distinct difference in how to approach the patient?

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