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Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits. Practicing lawyer, Senior Family Mediator, and former Licensed Clinical Social Worker with twelve years’ experience and an expert on navigating the Family Court process.
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TonyC
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« on: April 25, 2008, 10:37:09 AM »

ive been getting allot of requests for my story...im putting it here because its not part of my rebuilding,,,,,its something i am putting behind me...its not talked about by me  much anymore... i made some real bad choices, and some real mistakes...

to maintain a borderline realtionship...i dunno if all these requests are curous..or they think my life was just one big party...it is again... but it wasnt always...

and maybe i dont talk about it enough...to show i know what im talking about..

its not usual...to tell the whole story around here so mods , admins., skip if you need to move this...feel free...

and for those of you.. that want to know tonys story...here it is...

i was dating (c) for two years,,, she was a beautuful established attorney...i was the renegade bouncer...not a likely couple... she had model looks with a law degree..we hit it off we met at dmv on line... i asked her out and we went out...she was a class act... we turned heads when we were out as a couple... we wnet out parties every weekend... and she was always welcome where i worked... and she was not threatended by my job... she had a son he was autistic with violent tendancies...he roughed her up...on occasion.. and there wasnt much i could do i was not his father...so i was becoming frustrated..and started to pull back a little,, well alot... so the timing was right ...

i was working at the club...at the door...a birthday party came in...5 women...they were all frustrated house wives..they were all over me... excpet the tall blonde...so they went inside... i told another guy watch the door ...im goin to talk to..the tall blonde.. so i did i walked across the 700 people on the dance floor...found her...

introduced myself...hi im tony... she just said hi...my ego took a hit cuase she wasnt throwing herself at me? so we talked a little...not much goin on there... so i went back to the front door...and hit on the next woman up there...

so its the end of the night...her and the girls...were leaving they are kissing me good bye... and they would be back... the tall blonde just stood there as they were leaving...

i said can i help you...?she say i live with someone... i said i figured,..so i tell you what heres my number...if something changes call me...she never called...ok fine

she showed up at the club again... the next week ...with two of the same women...

i said you didnt call me... she said no i thought i would just come to see you...

and it began...

the lawyer called me ... wanted to talk about a week later...again i was pulling out..or back and she felt it... my mind was on yes guess who...

so the lawyer (c) and i met .. at a bar near her house...she said tony...i know your heads not in this... i feel it...i said yea your right...

she said i will make this easy for you she was tearing... im going to the ladies room... if i come out and your here i know there is hope for us...if your not here...i guess its over...and you should go and do what you have to do...and i hope you come back...she put her body up against me and kissed me... real hard and long... she knew my mind was on someone else...well when she came out of the ladies room i was not standing there...

i started dating guess who...2 months later...

i bumped into (c)... she walked over and said monday is my birthday.. want to take me out? i said i cant...she she just looked at her feet..i lifted her head by her chin.. and looked at her she was crying... i said what babe  dont  do this... she said... i heard... your seein someone.. i said yeah...she said i will give you more time tone...get it out of your system...i walked her to her car she was very upset...so was i  i didnt know what or who i wanted...i turned to look she was cryng behind the steering wheel... i kept moving...

it really hurts to write this...

leaving (c) crying in her car was my first...big mistake...the one that led to the end of life as i knew it...

i need to take a break..

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« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2008, 11:09:23 AM »

Tony...  xoxo
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« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2008, 11:24:16 AM »

Tony, we all love you so much! I know this is hard. I haven't had the guts to do mine yet. Hang in there!

xoxo

Chili
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« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2008, 11:36:24 AM »

Thanks for your courage in sharing this. xoxo
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« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2008, 11:40:33 AM »

Purging and clearing the conscience is "a good thing".

Take all the time you need.
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TonyC
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« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2008, 12:32:00 PM »

so...ive regrouped...and for the record  this is just digging up bad memories...

but many want to know where i was and where im at... this was all just a bad part of my life...

i am now in a typical realtionship...

hoping some of you read this...and pay attention... and hope you get where im at now...

so m and i now dated... she was tall sexy... no prettier that the lawyer...but there was something there...i dunno what...

her b/f moved out...well actually he came to the club... one night and confronted her there... in retrospect it was probably over for her ...she fell onto me... he just didnt know it... she told me he hit her  and drank , and her 2 husbands hit her and drank..

remeber i always tell you to look at the present to predict the future right...

later on i realised , she was the reason for whatever they did...and i was just next...

but again... i did not see it?

he was getting loud with her and i walked over and told him to get out...

he looked at me and obeyed...(do your see it... i saw it but i did not recognize it..(red flag.)

she was married twice...a kid from each marriage...he son... was a little off...a real introvert... but he loved me..i was stabilty ..the daughter was always out ..think she was trying to stay away from mom...she was getting married...mom had a fight with the fiance... and the daughter moved out... and dissapeared...

the son went to live with the father,...(again im seein sht red flags)but im not paying attention...

she called me on a fri night... my mom is in the hospital... could you come.. i said yea about 11... i get there and her family...is there? i hadnt met them..

the sister walks over and says...you dont beling here her b/f is here?

and he brought some of his friends ,he also said you dont belong here... so i told him and his friends to bite me... m came walking out...and hugged and kissed me i looked over at old b/f saying to myself some thing is worng here and shrugged it off...

so she stopped talking to her family ...after this hopital and me deal. ( yup another red flag)

the daughter now lived with her sister and noone talked to nonone...

i was it...her life now revolved around tony... and she was alwways screaming and yelling on the phone to some family member...started taxing us... big time..

so hert life was completely dimanteld now...

she moved in a apart ment at her best g/f... house...

she invited me over...and mad e dinner... and after that called me to the bedroom she was in a vic secrets out fit...bam i was locked in...she was no better or worse than any one else i slept with ...but she was different in the bedroom ... she left all her behaviors... in the living room...and was a different person...

things were ok... we were always at my place or her place...she came by my work at the club...she was insanely jealous though... she told everyone she was my wife... so women didnt talk to me...she watched my every move...i was also becoming less and less sociable... to suit her requirements..(red falg)...

well the bartenders g/f was always at the club to  m and kate became friends..,.soon to be best friends...all was good... things were really coming together...

this was probably at the one year mark...

well one night she had a fight with her best g/f and told her her son should drop dead... this was to be my first speech on what to say to someones mother...

well she got kicked out ...of there and moved on with the bartenders g/f

we were having some rough times... i was accused of everything...her daighter would call me and tell me tony mom is still seeing her old b/f... leave her... i didnt by that my ego would not allow it...

so things were starting to register her threat of violence, the cursing...the family the husbands ... the kids... i still couldt put it together...so me the ∂ƒ∫∆˚ dismissed it...

well shes now living with kate... kate and i were always friends... nothing more nothing less...so kate calls me at work one day and says tony im making dinner tonight come over , she wanted to thank me for helping her out at her house...i said ok wel when m gets home the three of us can have dinner together.. i said cool she said what do you like i said i love eggplant...she said ok thats what ill make...

so i get to the house... my g/f and kate are there she says hi...what are you doing her so early...i sadi kate invited me to dinner...shes says ohhhhhhh?

kate said i made him eggplant... and i dont remeber.

i see my g/f s horns come out... oh isnt that special she makes all your favorite stuff. and calls you and invites you over... i said yeah ? whats the problem... are you two going to be sleeping in the same bed later...(hope so) just kidding...

things were disintergrating... again... but i was in love but these things were rubbing me the worng way all over...again...

so the friction there was nerve wracking...but we got thru it...

what ever went on theat nigtht was forgotten so i thougt,,,

friday im at work kate comes ove and says...im working on clearing up some of her financial problems with her...

she didnt work was living off the ex b/f and money she had...

she got a job in a pediatric medical office.. she worked 9-5 in scrubs at the front desk...

she had a tude with all the bad parents had to hear about this 24/7 the kids mother was horrible cause she didnt take off work.. or didnt bring the kid in till 5 ... etc etc...

red flag(she was the best mother didnt even know where her kids were..)so back to the loan part...so she says im gonna take out a loan would you cosign ... she explains the ins and outs... i agree..

well my g/f walks in we talk about the loan... my g.f has a hemorriage.. about kate talking to me again... and they bioth leave... i tell my boss ill be right back...

i run over to the house ...10 blocks away they are fighting physically... i separate them...protect kate who is 1 4'9 and my g.s was 5'9...

i tell g/f i am done... i cant deal... but i still havent put this together...

i walk away... i n/c her...

i miss her but what do i miss? i dont know

i start dating...(s) she owns a medical supply company...porche really hot...

again were dating...for months... awesome... but i think there wasnt enough drama fro me...s goes to massachusets. for a week on buisness.. guess who shows up...at my door ,,,,,,,

yup...i let her suck me back in... she now lives with another best freind about 30 miles away...and she still works at the medical office...she was fired cause she could not work with other women...

intermission...

feel free to ask questions... if you wish...

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« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2008, 12:51:16 PM »

Tony,

I remember your story from long ago.  I remember the talks in the park, then...I remember one day you just had enough and were through.   This was at least a year ago (I think)   

As you go through this, try to remember if there was one moment or stage where you "saw the light" Maybe it was self awareness...maybe it was realizing it'd never change.  I remember one time the shrink told you something to the effect..."It will never change"  I was using a diff screen name then...but I remember how hard things were for you then. 

I remember the old Tony and I see where you are now...I'm just really glad for you.  Getting this out again will reinforce how much you have changed and why you'd never go back!  Thanks for sharing

P.S.  Don't forget the VS re-engagement at XMAS!  Ok, this is your story to tell...not mine 



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« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2008, 01:01:39 PM »

mike i got while before i get there ...or last weeks card...

so many been e mailing me asking what was your story , how do you know so much..

so im sharing...

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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2008, 01:14:00 PM »

yea, I know...

I remember those days when you were standing there...heart ripped out...after the "other guy"

luggage on the front porch...psych ward...pills, Eggshells/coffee table, blamed for wearing 

cologne...those things you went through.

Tony, sometimes I marvel at your turnaround.  I will never be able to share with you how much your posts

have helped me.  The price you've paid, crap endured.  and still getting re-engagemented!  I know you'd trade it in for a non re-engagement...but you're out and a success story!


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TonyC
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« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2008, 01:22:10 PM »

so she now lived thirty miles away...things got better we werent so close...

still no family...i let her into mine... but since i was not in her line of sight.. i was always cheating...dont know how long this lasted...but i was in love with her...

but i knew she was off...didnt know what.. but something...

so guess what she had a fight with her new b/f ...yup it was moving time again...

so she moved again... to her freinds 10 min from me...im still in love with her... but i feel the life being sucked out of me...

well i allowed her to isloate me from anything in my life...it was work and her thats it.

im still workin in the club... she was no longer allowed there becusae she would threaten all the female customers...

so she got a job bartending...i was not allowed where she worked becuse bartenders have to make them selves seem available even though they arent...

she was having a good time... drinking , center of atteniton, guys hitting on her which she shared...when ever she coudl(red flag #56)  

women from my club would go over to her club... and throw i saw tony in her face she wasnt well liked... and she would volley back... and ususally take this out on me... at some point during the night...usually around 4 am...

she would rage throw sht...

we broke up again...she was hanging out at her club when i was working .. even though she wasnt working... this was just rubbiong me the worng way...condidering i wanst allowed out of the house when i wasnt working..(red flag)

i told her her behaviors are not normal...this is about 3 years in.. off and on break ups..

her g.f agreed...

well guess what she got kicked out again... fight with newest and only g/f left...

so... i had seen 175 red flags...

she agreed to see a therapist... and i let her move in with me...

i will continue this...i just have some stuff to do

should i keep going?

is this what some of you wanted...

and newbies are you able to put your name in my story?

ask questions...this may be a little hap hazzard... but time stood still for 5 years...
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2008, 02:16:33 PM »

You're doing great, Tone. Take it to then end.   :-*
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« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2008, 02:17:48 PM »

Bring it...no edits TOny!
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« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2008, 02:54:17 PM »

Yeah no edits and don't leave any of the good stuff out. We're a demanding crowd here. Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

PS - The best thing to get to is the re-engagements and sum up what happens (more hell to pay for the non). But we know you'll get there and tell us the part when M showed up at your door and knew your gf was over where you had to finally call to have her arrested. (I think I have the story right.. correct me if I messed it up).


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TonyC
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« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2008, 03:12:45 PM »

after im pulling out once again... she goes to find a therapist...

well im talking to her kids at this time she dont know it...they liked me were embarrased of her.. and her past maybe her future...

i was still close with her family...she didnt know that either...

i fixed that too... everything was falling into place...

the daughter got married... they got a house we were a couple again...many months went by... still had some sht goin on...had another fight with the family over who didnt send a birthday card,,, to someone and she shut the family out agin...

which made my life a living hell once again... the raging the fights...

but during that time... her neck hurt... and she got depression... and well as manic this and manic that... and bi...

so she the t refers her to a shrink... they throw the medicine chest at her.. shes on six pills a day... she is a walking zombie... her looks are rapidly deteriotingt from being a pill junkie... and im trying to keep this together...

so its now me and her ...and the bone doctor tells her she needs work on her neck and they are going to take a bone out of her hip... and put a piece in the cervical section of her neck...this is schedule for 6 months... from then..

im still doing my thingat the club... got 50 women a night hitting on me...and im going home to bone pain , and mental sedatives...i was having a hard tiime running home but i did...

but friday and sat night... she pushed her boobs up.. and went out with the girls...no neck pain.. no nothing...she was perfect...

she was 45 the girls were from her club... oh yea she got fired... so i was supporting her...she took her meds. then want out and drank till 4 or 5 am...i got home at 4 she started puking soon as she walked in the door... so my weekend was fifnished becsuae i gave her the speech.. about drugs and alchohol... and that resilted in me walking away. for the weekend ... or catch an errand asstry in the head ... with her yelling your not my father...

well she raged i pulled back... but is till was loya... called her every hour from the club.. to keep her mind in check...

didnt ride my harley... chics you know.. pushed my family away..

it was just me and her my frustrartions were peaking...i didnt know why  i stayed...

she was still going to the t  and the shrink.. and was now on dissabilty... so she had 218 per month which paid for tanning, hair and nails...and i paid the rest ...

so she had the neck job...it was just me and her.. her family was gone..my brothers and sisters helped me with her... believe that? why for me... they saw what she was doing to me... but i still did not see it?

she came out of the sugery,,, and it got real bad.. she was stuck in the house for 3 months... i ran home twice a day to check on her.. and feed her.. for me to come home at night and say hi babe how was your day>>

to be cursed out for asking...

she was now back on her feet ...collecting dissabilty and in the bars while i worked...

taking pills seeing a t... it was stressing...

i was cursed at , got stiches, belittled, you name it she did it...

but then things leveled out...

some thing changed...but we were back to being us...we werehappy...

it was a friday night...

i got dressed for work.. she was now staying at home... i ran home at 4 am.couldnt wait to see her,, and she could wait to see her... we went away.. for the wekend...no raging no cusring...some epihany took place this was for about 6 months..now...

so i went to the front door she came out of the bedrrom... and said hurry up home tone...as she dropped her top to the floor and came to the door kissed me...

i drove to work and said you really are a good looking woman,,,and youve been great ill see if ican get out early...i clled from work and said ya know what babe youve been doing so well im taking off sat night we will go out... ok she said sweeeet i cant wait...

i got off at 3 instead of 4...

i was hungry i stopped in mcdonalds...brought us some thing to eat...i pulled uop at the house at 3:15 her car wasnt there ... thougjt  maybe she went for cigarrettes or some thing..?

i walked in ... turned the lights on...

everything was gone...plants on the floor tables gone, clothes gone, all her personal stuff gone...nails where pictures were?

i droped the mcdonalds on the floor... i looked in all the rooms...

in the kitchen was a note... all it said was sorry..

she wouldnt take my calls...i sat and cried sitting on the floor of the living room till io fell asleep being exhausted working 21 hours...

monday i called her t...e said tony none of this behavior, is supported in her dissaorders.. being the victim of abuse for since child hood...

i said what abuse...everyone has been kissing her ass for the past 45 years..

he said the father...i said spiled the sht out of her

he said mother...coddled her...

sister             they were like twins...

husbands .. i think she screwed them over...

kids... they ran from her...because of her behaviors..

he said tony... we need to talk... but i need to out you on as a patient.. so you can tell me about her...i said ok... he said tone ou dont sound good you want to come by and i will give you something,,, to help... i said no thanks...

i will tell you about the t and the shrink and my entrance to bpdfamily...

monday...

this is one ugly story.. reading it...
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« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2008, 03:19:01 PM »

Oh my God, Tony...

I knew your story must have been rough, but WOW...

My heart is aching for you, just  reading it...

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« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2008, 03:27:40 PM »

im out now and im happy and life is good...

monday i will continue... we didnt get to the good stuff yet...
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« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2008, 04:28:13 PM »

We all have our story and can commonly link each of our experiences with each other as we all lived through similar things.  My story is boy meets girl, boy marries girl, they are happy, they have baby, boy gets new job, they move, boy is seduced by career and money, boy turns into a workoholic, girl warns boy, girl reminds him to focus on God and family, boy does not listen, girl starts to withdraw, girl is tired of many nights alone with small baby in a new city, boy commits adultery, boy cracks up, boy punishes girl.

Keep your story coming Tony, I am recanting my story vicariously through yours...     
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« Reply #17 on: April 25, 2008, 04:55:59 PM »

Thank you for sharing all this Tony.  There is a reason you are such a good life coach here.  You lived it. 

Thank you for all you do for us here... xoxo
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« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2008, 09:23:16 PM »

Monday ! Tony  you are a complete Tease ! I need more of the story NOW!

A weekend cliffhanger from a " Distinguished Member" no less ...

I don't know ... there's a new multiple personality board opening up .. they share ALL of their stories at once ... I may have to join .. the multiple ,multiple screen names are a bit confusing though ...

Noah   
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« Reply #19 on: April 25, 2008, 11:16:09 PM »

Noah you are a nut!  I supose we could just make up the rest of his story.  But somehow I know it would not be as eventful if we tried to make it up.  Afterall Tony tells me all the time, "you can't make this stuff (ok he does not say stuff)up".
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« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2008, 07:45:24 AM »

so at this point i have survived about

10 smashed cell phone... any female voice... she would smash it..

10 break ups..

1 time arrest for asaoulting anouther woman.

her now prescription junkies status..

guys from the bar she works at calling her(this was ok)

5 or so kick outs buy landlords..

3 or 4 lost jobs..

her family disconnecting .. my family letting me figue out what i was doing,,,while watching form a distance

all the criteria was met... i just still didnt know why i stayed...

women from the club were all over me...take me out... what are you doding after work tony...i wanted no part of anything... i just went home to my stripped house...

and drank myself to sleep... i was loosing it...

i did not call her.. and she wasnt calling me...

so i went to see her t...we had met before real nice... but...



Pay attention here


so i sit with the doctor... for two years now... she climing the father abused her, the mother abused her, her jjob abused her, the world abused her...

the t goes on to say... tone something is so miissing from her story...

i started to talk...he cancellled his other appoint ments..  we spoke for 3 hours...

he was amazed...at what i had to say...

he pulled a book off the shelf and asked me questions...9 to be exact...

i said yes to all of them except ...for one... i said is prescription pills over use and alcholol self harm...he said yes...

he said tone she is a bordeline and has been for 35 years or better...i said what to i do...? hes says you... nothing   

you stay away from this...your too nice a guy to thru anymore of this...

ddate my secratary she wants to go out with you,,,, i wanst to entertained ...

he said you love her... i know that or you wouldnt be here...i said yes...

so he said let me talk to her... and told me what ever happened her never happended you are a patient now ok...and so is she,.,,,,

now this is over lets go outside...

so we went outside...we lit ciagettes... and he said...

ok i am now a pdoc now ... im your friend...

tony you can help her ... you need to get away from this...

i was tearing...he said.. you can see 200 women ... she is the last one youwant to be with...

he went on to say he is going to talk to her in her next session...and her diagnoses is going to be BPD. plus this  , plus that...

and he said im not really eqipped to handle this...hes not trained...

i said ok doc...we hugged i went home to sit in isolation...


about a weel later guess who calls... it her dauughter..

she want to come over...the daughter says mom is not right tone...i said where is she ?

she lives with me...what happened...?

i said i dont know i came home and she was gone?

she says you didnt know.. i said no? she called the (m)s g/f who came over...

she said you didnt know she was moving? i said no?

they looked at me i was tearing up...

they were crying...she told us you knew alll bout it and you were cheating and staying out all night...

i said ... what ?

i went to work 22 hours a day and ran home to her.. to have guys calling her cell phone, and her smashing my phone cause my sister called... i wanst cheating..or anything... she was coming home throw up drunk art 4 am?

they said she swore i knew all about this...i said i knew nothing...

i was throwing up after i saw my house...

we helped her move tone...and we would have not helped her if she told the truth...

so here we are...

i surfed the net... i spent 6 months at bp d recovery...

i didnt know it was for those who have BPD?

bear and a bunch of others adpoted me...

i would tell my stories and the BPDs even bashed her and told me to get way...from her...i would tuen on my computor and the first thing that came up was the BPD recovery people wanted to know what has she done lately... they were a great bunch...

but thhey started fighting over me... they got to attached to me...

and the senior mod...asked me to start pulling away ..  cause they were fighting in post over me... so i did

they stered me to bpdfamily...

...preddessor to facts...

i met j,k, len, turtle, pdquick, oy, ...elph, gary,  many others...soem still here .. some are gone...

i was allover this BPD stuff... i was taking notes talking...listening...

i felt like i founf the holy grail... man these people

kep tme from endingt my life.. i was dying on the inside...

i had nothing left...nothing...

i still worked the club... had my game face on...guys would still walk up and say...

man i want to be you ... just for one night...

i would say... not this month you dont...

so all the people here... told me to run.. run,, run, and they were right right right...

well the t spoke to m.. i seesion...on a tuesday...

he officallly diagnosed her BPD.. and sent her to a pscyh...that could handle BPD..

i did not chase i did not call...for weeks...i actually started dating...

and man i was having fun...there wasnt a night i was alone... i was off the hook...

i slept with . slept over,, went to bars can clubs...

i would walk in to a place with some hottie... friends of my actually bowed when i walked in...i was a total player...women would just grab my hand...and take me away for the weekend, take me to a club , a bar.. to manhattan...

i was a playboy...

but when i was alone my thoughts were on her...i was getting tired of running from my thoughts...

saturday night i was in a bar...close to my house... and close to m's t's office...

guess who walked in the  therapist...

we drank a few shots...some woman was trying tio get my attention and the t started telling her..hiow great i am and stuff...like that...

he says tony shes a sinking ship...i dont want you with her...find someone else...

so him and i are now sitting with 4 or 5 women...hes like tone why would you go back to her.. when you can hve this? is it always like this with you...

i had a few drinks...

i walked out side... he sid toonnnnee?

i want her back doc...he said i know i see it in your eyes...

i think a tear or two fell the tequilla shots.. werent helping this...

some beatiful girl came out and said... tone cmon...

i said... go inside... bambi.. or whoever your are...

the doc... he was funny tone...you just insulted that babe? i said yea,.. i dont give a sht...

tell me what you want tone im advising you move on...you cant fix this...

bpdfamily told me to run., i read everybook i could on BPD. . i spoke with marsha linehan...i was emailing randi...

i was more versed in BPD, and dbt...than her doctors...

helped me...

about 4 months passed buy...m called me wanted to meet...just hearing her voice...my heart started to beat again...

she asked me to meet her at the t's office...

i threw my life away again...

to be continued...
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« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2008, 12:37:39 PM »

she called i heard her voice... just the voice...broke me...

so what i learned thus far..

she had a severe mental disorder...it was BPD.. it was uncurable...

i learned form bpdfamily, www-page-not-found-net,the books, the quizzs...

the self reflection...

i was told to run... buy everyone who talked to me... i heard them

but i was meeting the pscyh and the shrink and her on monday...

i had a diagnoses...but i didnt know what to do with this...

i had to think over the weeend...
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« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2008, 12:41:30 PM »

Well I don't know what you do for a living Tony but you have a way with words

and a way with people,, and all those girls - I need to come up and take notes! kidding...

Through all this...you are going to find more of yourself.
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« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2008, 04:37:07 PM »

and a way with people,, and all those girls - I need to come up and take notes! kidding...

You don't have to go see him to figure this out.  I can tell you.  Two reasons he does so well...He loves and respects women and he is a gentlemen.  I know this because I went and met him and I saw it first hand.  Both men and women would benefit if he would open some sort of charm school for men. 
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« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2008, 06:00:21 PM »

thanks tony for sharing your story. i know it's not easy to revisit those past memories and feelings of your xBPD. also thanks for taking the time to see and acknowledge when i was "rounding the corner." it meant a lot to me. it helped me see that i was moving on and away from the past.
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« Reply #25 on: April 27, 2008, 08:01:46 PM »

Tone

I've loved your writting and mind since I first read one of your posts.  And now I love you.  You're a very special man.

Recovering
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« Reply #26 on: April 28, 2008, 08:40:21 AM »

so i was now jumped back into dating... to get my mind off her... and she called ...

i met her at the t ...

she was now living with newest best freind...

i was back to riding my harley..i wasnt allowed before... becuse that meant woman?

so i pulled up on my bike...

we said hello... we walked in she made a few comment about my bike and the shirt i was wearing etc etc...

we sat down... the doc said you both are headed doe some rough road her but you both want to be together...i still have voices in my head saying dont do it tone , dont do it... you have been enjoyin life...

work was great... i was dating all over...parties, etc etc...

my confidence was back... the phone was ringing on the weekends...i waould go to a water club on the shore meeting friends and leaving with the hottest women in the place...with no reservations..., and taking no prisoners...

so we talked with the t ... i was gettting more versed with BPD as trhe days went on...

and the doc explained to her,...what it was gonna take to help her...and me and the family and life in general...

she was now in full agreement...im looking at her... feeling like ... i was going to go back...and i was scared ? could i go back i dont know...

so we all agreed on making it work...and we headed for the parking lot... i said ... ill call you...she said wait tone...

are we together? i dont know i said...

she leaned up on me...i couldnt push her away...she kissed me...

she asked if i would take her out tonight...i said i had plans...she asked me to break them...

i did... we went on a date... we wnet to my house later that night... slept together... and yup... i was back in...

but we agreed not to live together... and i still had women coming to the house...to see me...

i was afrid to shut my life down again... but i made a commitment to her and the t...

but i want sure if i was doing this for me or or her?

i dont remeber makig a decision... i just remember pullinmg down the curtain on my life again...i had changed... during this time apart though i would not let her get as close as i did before...

she had me take her for books,, lost in the mirror, and all the other i have BPD books...

she highlighted , her and i did study groups together... things were cool... but i found myself be ing a BPD instrstrutor..

ans she was the student... i erected my boudaries... and all that ...

but she was still having attacks...and raging,...and months had gone by...

and my playboy path... was still follwing me... the phone would still ring...and we would go out... and bump into someone i dated... and the sht would start...

and she was heavily medded up...

and i kept saying what am i doing?

but it was ok.. i thought... her famil;y had come back , the daughter came back her son came back... evdrything was ok...

but i was everyones savior...the reason they all came back... because i added stability...to the whole situation...but it taxed the hell out of me...

some time went by ...

she took another job bartending... and the behaviors were starting again...

and i was lecturing... and had my podium on the dos and donts of a BPD relationship...

and had out my cement and bricks... and was buliding a wall to protect myself...

i think this period... we last ed 6 or 7 months...im not sure...

the family she stopped talking to again,...and i was once again felt like my back was up against the wall...she took another baretending job... it was falling apart again...

she started drinking... and staying out.. while i wasnt allowed to see talk to be near... anyone.. i was isolated again...

her family stayed in contact with me...making likfe hard...i was wone again.. fullly emeshed in the BPD relationship...

so i struggled again...and we fought , she raged...

but it was so up and down... her t and shrink didnt know what to say but tony we told you so...you cant fix this..., and dont let her move backl in...

so it was fourht of july... we were ggoing to a party...it was a really good persiod...

were driving home to change to go to another party...on the way home she say tony... i want to move back in with you...

i said what ? your not ready...im not going thru all this again... i cant...

nothing has changed .. you broke all the rules... all of them...

so she ran out of the house..threw and ashtray...and i said ...see...?

and she left... i let her go..

i jumped on my harley ... and was off on a ride to nowhere . andother holiday ruined...

her g.f called me and said... tone shes all crazy... dont leave her here with me at the party...i didnt call back...

the phone rang again... remeber im on the bike...i pull over, i answer tony please come here shes crying and crazy...dont let her ruin my party...

so i go,... i get there and she runs at me...throws hers arms around me kisses me and says,whay arent you kissing me... ..

i said not here not now...dont ruin this party...

so we stay... we go home...

i tell her i have become your baby sitter once again...

you are bring nothing to the table..., you took another sht job... against your therapists advice... your drinking on contoled meds, you started sht with your family again... ..i told her i made agreements with your t and shrink...not to let you move back in...and im keeping to this... ..she told me they are both stupid... i said really...

so we got thru the night she turned in to sweet...

and i waoke up that morning knowing this wansnt goint to work...

and we went to her t that night...

and i told him of the last few weeks and the moving in requests and all that...

he told her she was not keeping with the program... and tony was...

i told her in the ts office... im done...

she screamed yelled... slammed ... and took off...

the t said ... what is there to say tone? i warned you... please listen to me...

let her go...the t said... she is beyond me... she is beyond you...

she cant be cured ... she still isnt buying in...

so i think i lasted 3 or 4 months...

she still raged...

she still made poor decisions..

she still could not be trusted...

she still exhibited...all the criterisa of a full blown borderline...

and i was tight backl where i started...forced to push her away...

so the t was done also... he dropped her...and the shrink... and the daughter took her in... cuase her newest b/f was kicking her out...

i was done yes once again...

she was calling,, hangin up , i saw her car aound the neighbor hood... i missed her... but i learned to resist the re-engagements... and once again i was rebuilding

you think i dated before?

i wasnt crazy... i had to find a replacement fast...i met ,  i dated... i answered the phone again...i was all over ny...

but she was still in my head... my heartt wasnt letting go...

but my mind was busy...

so for the next nine months..i had a few possible relationships...

but every three  months the ex surfaced...

she called to ask if she left a pen behind...

she called , she called , she was at my house... she came to my job... she came to the club,,, told any one who waould listed she was my wife,...

she wasnt stopping...

and i would not engage...conversations or talk to her...

i resisted , i called cops...i had an ro...

so.. i changed phones...everything...

i was done yet again...you think,,, i thought so...

i was now for 9 months a single happy batchelor...

things were good...

during that time... the person she lived with...(b) died .. she never was healthy she was a friend of mine since h/s...

weel i had found out her and my ex had a fight over? who knows what and had kicked my ex out...

i had spoken to the daughter around the time of the wake... i met the daughter at the wake...i said you mom coming... she said no she hated ( b) for throwing her out...

i was like so she s not coming to the wake...she said i doubt it... i said good.. i dont want to see her anyway...

so the daughter and i talked... not about her mother...

and the daughter had a problem at the house ... and her and her husbannd could afford to fix.. the oil burner ... i said i would help you...but im not with your mother around...

the daughter said i havent seen her tone... i kicked her out...

i said what ? i kicked her out she said... she was drinking... and coming home late and i could not let my 2 and 4 year olds... see this ...

she is a mess...

she lives with some guy now...

i was happy but not...i didnt know what to feel.. i didnt know why i cared... or did I?

so here we are...

she gone.. and she has still been calling me... but i didnt know she was calling me

hwile living with some guy...

so i ended it at the ts office..

she went ?

her family is still in touch with me...

im moving on...

the t and shrink dropped her..

the newest b.f kicked her out..

her daughter kicked her out...

she now lives with new guy...

i rebuilt my life again...

im seeing women... i am sifting thru the woman pile looking for the one...

i am meeting great woman ... and im ready to settle down...

i just want , peace, trust, love , and calm...

no more roller coaster...no more...

ive learned...

i recognize she is a low fuctioning border line  who will not accept... or listen.. to psychs, therapists,. anyone... her life is the same as when i came into it...

and long long before i came allong...

i am back to holding hands, smiling..., kissing,, laughing...things are really good for me...

i am on my way out of oz...

i survived her showing up..., in vic sercets out fits, the letters, the parking out side of my house at night...

and she is doing this while she lives with the new guy... which..

hey im an BPD experts now...

i see it ... i know the areas of criteria she is meeting...i anticipate... i know her moves..

but this things are getting in my head...i just didnt realise it...

and she is still in my head...

but i cant go see the daughter  and the grankids, we dont talk about her mom... i play on the lawn with the kids... i get invited to dinner ,,,,

i leave there and go out with  a date that night... feeling pretty good about life..

but this is all damageing me...i am re-engaging my self...

or am i ...

i realise i am too too close to any of this... so i pull back...

i cant get out unless i severe alll the ties...

i refer to it as collateral damage...  i cant be involved with any of this... and be menatally healthy and move on...

so i do...i ttell the daughter and hus, 

im glad i could help you... and things have been great ... but im not realy moving on...

so ... this is it...

and i severed the ties...

it was part of operation clean sweep

remove any last attachements or anything that could trigger a thought...

i even sold the harley...reminded me of her..

cut any and all things that could make me think... , or feel...

but i would still...find myslef slapping my self in the face...saying stop it tony...

dont think about her ...

the next chapter will begin...
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« Reply #27 on: April 28, 2008, 09:32:54 AM »

So she still re-engagements...I can see how this would be messing with my mind.  Kind of like a regular test...

Some people yearn for the re-engagement..."why doesn't she call or ask about the braclet/trinket she left at the house"   I know you'd trade in a sec for no more, just to get clear of this once and for all.

Tony, I know u know its good to stay away from the family to avoid the collateral damage.  I hope you can accept this is the best way for you and there's no way to fit a visit in here and there and fully get over her.  You know you don't have to by hypervigalent but I still sense you're worried you'll hurt some by cutting all ties (100% clean sweep)  They know and understand Tony.

Sometimes we get out and still have loose change in our pocket.  Call this the kids, the innocent (remaining ties)  I tell myself that I have people that are friends, that I care about and I never talk to because I just can't.

I hope this was good for you to share.


Mike

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« Reply #28 on: April 28, 2008, 09:50:39 AM »

Aw Tony ---  I know that you know I'm on a little break from bpdfamily.com right now, but I still check in and I've been reading this thread.  I really just posted so this so it would show up in my topics and I wouldn't have to keep sifting through everything else to find it -- Laugh out loud (click to insert in post).

I remember when you first came here -- Hell, I remember when I first came here too!  It's been quite the journey for both of us.  I'm glad we're both finally on the other side.

I'm glad you're posting this.  The sht you've dealt with is over the top and if you can make it out -- everyone else can too!  Continue...

Turtle  xoxo




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« Reply #29 on: April 28, 2008, 10:20:46 AM »

yeah mike i completely disconnected...

and was going on with my life...

now more ts. no more work books,

and yea the phone calls kept coming at work couldnt change that number...

and she would stop in at work...

and came buy in a vic secrets out fit... uinder her coat...

i was desparately trying to diconnect...

iu had ros. and stuff...this wasnt working wither...

i was always one step foward two steps backk...

allot of sht...went on during this time... but i was able to shake it off...

i did away with every aspect of her...phsyiaclly , emmotionally , meantally...

she was an occasional thought...

i think i blocked out much of it too... cuase im not remebereing the way i sued too..

the vivid ness has fadded...

but i was dating (l) she was my ticket out...she had it all

i thought,, she was smokin hot.. to llok at , she was funny, she gave me my space... i gave her hers... nothing of her reminded me of the bordrline relationship...

it was all good...

she had confrontation with psycho during one her re-engagement visits...and she stepped up...

i think this might have pushed psycho over the edge...

this also screwed up (l) who now had to be my keeper...my head was all screwed up again... if the re-engagement didnt get me it got to (l)..

and she now was policing me...and it was pretty much the end of us...

so mission re-engagement accomplished...

i stayed single again.. and was dating again...

months later


a wednesday night... i get a call ..on my new cell number, she got the number from her daughter phone i later found out...so i dont know the number..

i answer... hi tone its me...

i got this whole ... feeling like.. everthing distorts like in the movie the matrix...

i say hi... whats up...

i just wanted to talk...i needed to hear your voice...

and then i hear...

a guy... why are you direspecting me like this,,,

then i hear him say lemme guess its tony, right...

im like holy sht... i cant believe this and hang up...

but the friggen voice... got my head spinning...

i shake it off...

weeks later...

then a friday night... im at work ..

14 voice mail messages... at 4 am...she got the number she stole it from the daughter phone... they were speaking again...

the 15 th message was her live in b/f

he leaves a message to stop calling her... ..

said tony...please stop calling my g/f...i am now pissed this sht is going on...

i call this guy back...i said this is tony...

and if you check your phone...

all those calls to night are outgoin calls...

i never called her ...

he says i see that ... sorry ..

i said its cool... he says you want her back... shes a piece of work...

i said no thanks ... shes all yours...

now you think this is over right...

there is so many things ... i could go back and look at in my posts... but much it i really cant remeber...

but its not over...not by a long shot...

so in this time period...

i cut out any ties...

even places...

so i had my family back..., work was good, i was dating...doing what ever i felt like doing...

i had life,.,. i smiled...

this last episode...let me look back at the gates of oz...

i knew , i practiced., i disconnected...

i shrugged everything off as just a bad period of time...in my life


i got tired...of changing my number..., ex g/f s of her wanted to date me but i put them on that list of things i cut out...,


i was once again free... i allow my self to be free...of the past...

and yea she still contracted me... now with letters... looking for a hair clip...

a special coat hanger... etc etc...

new years eve came ... i was at work... at the club...

guess who walks up on me...

i tell her to get out...she put on considerable weight.30 lbs?

but she still looked good...my wounds were once again.. bleeding...

i leave work at 5 am...its now new years day...

she is at my truck...i said should nt you be with your b/f whey are you here...

she says no thats over... why dod you make me go find another man...

and starts crying you made me this , you made me that,,,,

i said enough... this was all you...

i stood by you every step... and you did not accpet any of it...

you took the pills thats it,,,, you have been you for 35 years... and i finally realise i cant make change happen...so i had to change some thing and thats me...

she told me how miserable she has been...blah blah blah...and she moved in with tha daughter... and how could i ignore her calls for help   i was always there for her... and so and so on...i cursed her out ... for punishing me... over the last years...


i left... i went to a hotel... i was not going home...

it was quiet again... for 3 weeks or so,...

my heart was saying... maybe... my brain was firm on no... no... no..

i was staying with no...

but it seemed like i was trying to pull away , and whenever i got to a point... where i could stop and catch my breathe...she was there... in some way shape or form...

i would mow my lawn... and the hair on the back of my neck would stand up...

i knew ..she was close...

i was in total paranoia... 24/7...

why?i dont know...

but then through... dating,,, and family and work... i was finding all the little pieces of me... and every day i got stronger...and i was once again me...

i survived the letters, i survived the phone calls, i survived the didconnections.. from her family... they also knew it was best for me...,

her living with a guy .. then moving to the daughters... scared me though,,,but be that as it may...

i was once again... tony...

i was a use ful person again... i was leaving oz.., i was round 14 or so,,a force to be reckoned with... my weekends started at 5 pm on friday... and didnt end till 6 am monday...

party city..., date maybe... , sleepover sure.., come to a party be right there...

i was living the life most men,,,, would hate me for...i was loving it...

but i started hearing the jaws theme in my head again,,,,,

i gave my self permission... to go renegade.. again...i had only one rule to be happy...

i was out way out of oz...in every aspect...

i even threw away the books... i was done with BPD...done...no more...

months went by...i was happy... i loved the weekends , i loved the holidays...

i liked going home... i liked parties, social events...

my family had me over ... all the time... life was once again... a sunny day everyday...

i learned so much here and was finally practicing what i preach...

then...

then the shark ... came to the surface... and i saw the fin sticking up...out of the water...

and it was coming at me...

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« Reply #30 on: April 28, 2008, 10:56:12 AM »

Lets just accept it Tony...This is hard as hell.  I know ur not going back.  But the effect its having on you deep down.  Are you dealing with that?  (You don't have to answer here...but just ask yourself this...Are you dealing with it ?  How is this affecting you?  When you ask this of yourself...don't just say..."I'm ok..I'm over it...etc."  I know that about you.  I know you're strong but deep down I sense you're still hurt and this coming back of hers isn't easy.  This isn't allowing you the space to move on you need.  Shoulders feel heavy at times, right? 

Just asking you these questions because I Know deep down, I'm not 100% myself yet. 

It might be a good time for a personal vacation...take off for 3-5 days ...away from the city..no dates, no bikes, somewhere new, somewhere different.  This may help..

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« Reply #31 on: April 28, 2008, 11:16:31 AM »

actually ... im real good...

most of this actually...all of it..

reinforces...

that i did what was good for me

i thought i had my closure.. many times... i do at this point...

i am not witting this. as some one who is still in it so to speak...

looking at this stuff... is the hard part...

going back i was kidding myself ... i was never out ... a part of me was always in like many of you...

and really none of this is hard...i can tell this i guss objectively... and as a narrator...

i dont have the feelings... any more... ,

and i dont have the compassion required.. to keep me in...

i think some where in there my love turned into... the same care i would give to an abandoned orhpan...

at on time it was a love like have felt for noone... but those ups and downs of the roller coaster maybe wore me out...

till i could be objective...and the deep down... yea maybe... but i use it to make me a better person...

i now donate all the headspace...to someone worthy...

i develped my own issues from this realtionship...lack of trust,, loss of self respect..

co depenancy..., i beacme selfish,,,,..my walls were 50 feet tall... and ife was going by...amd i over it... yes..., could i ever go back, no...do i think about her...

some times... but not often...

and for every good thought... it is follwed by a bad thought...

i dont dwell on it...where i used to...

i worked thru them a little at a time...as many of you will...

therapists help... but you have to help yourself too...

and you have to want to get out from under...and not anylyze every second of your future...that makes for a guarded life...

and life is about shareing...

and allow yourself to grow... and shake off the fleas...

she might be tucked away in my head.. somewhere... but my heart is going other places...it no longer needs her ...



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« Reply #32 on: April 28, 2008, 11:28:10 AM »

just checking.  I hear ya and you sound good.

yes, that's the good thing as you say...telling this story makes it clear where you were and never want

to go again. 
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« Reply #33 on: April 28, 2008, 11:30:50 AM »

Tony,

You have been through so much and we all appreciate you writing it all down for us. So many BPD traits are exhibited in your ex and it makes it easy for me to cross reference to Psycho Man.

Thank you for taking this time to give us your story!

Chili

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« Reply #34 on: April 28, 2008, 11:31:37 AM »

I remember when you disappeared off the boards for awhile, T.  I know I missed seeing your posts.   Smiling (click to insert in post)  And it's so amazing to see where a lot of us have been, and where we are now.  Your story was compelling in that it was the story of so many of us who had been in Oz for shorter periods.  The vortex was just as strong, and the crazy came on with us shaking our heads going "HUH?"

Glad you're still here and doing what you're doing, Tone.   xoxo
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« Reply #35 on: April 28, 2008, 12:42:44 PM »

"and for every good thought... it is follwed by a bad thought..."

Amen TonyC, amen to that...they make it so hard to focus on any good at all because the bad is so bad.

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« Reply #36 on: April 28, 2008, 02:14:37 PM »

time went by ... i had the cops over cause she was parked out side.. she confronted carious women at my house, was coming to work.. she would be in my drives way at 4 am... i

i was scaredto go home again... and i could not surrender to her.. and offer my self again... i just couldnt...

well one morning i woke up to some one kissing me...

it was her...

i jumped up...i was like what are you doing here...how do you know i was alone...she said it was a chance i had to take...

i said i could call the cops...

so i smelled her,,, ths kiss felt good...

but i knew i could not do this...she was violating everything i had worked for...

but im looking at her.. and it wasnt the same for me...

i felt sypathy... as i would an orphan...

my heart was dying to hold her and tell her everything would be ok... but my brain knew it wouldnt...she didnt even look the same... her looks were deterorating, or were they... could my mind have made her beautiful? i dont know...

so im talking to her... and i said i cant do this... i really cant ...i cant let you hurt me again... and ive moved on...

she says ive heard it a sarcastic tone... your doin just fine. arent you i said yes...

so how do i compete tony... i said there is no competition... your behaviors and actions.. forced me out...

she said im ready to change i have nothing left...

i said i cant...it would never be the same... or maybe im afraid it would be the same...

i told her to leave...she did...i watched her walk to the car...i found  out later it ws her boyfriends car... the one who kicked her out...dont ask? i dont know...

but her mission was successful... i was all screwed up agian...

a few more attempts .. more cops...

so saturday night she came over...again..but i was on my way out...

she said she wanted to try again... i told her no...

but i was looking at her eyes...

i was a paramedic... quit after 911.

she was over dosed...i could tell by her pupils... i went to her car got her pocket book .. five or six empty pilll bottles... .. i called 911.. went to her grabbed her.. and made her puke... rainbow of pils came up...  i went ot the hospital with her... help the medic on board...

she was out there...

well the stabilized her and put her in the psycho ward...

i called her daughter... and told her what went on...

man i was knee deep in guilt... i stayed with the ex visiting... etc... taking care of.. talking to dr.s and psyches...

3 monthe later she came out... i was still struggling to hang onto my new life...

but i was allowing guilt to pull it away...

well three montsh later... i felt my self not wanting to be around her again... nothing had changed , she cursed out her family on the phone...because they never visited or called ,, her son still wanting nothing to do with her..., the daughter was looking to me for answers...cause the daughter didn know if she wanted her around the kids anymore..

that left... me...and i was too scared...of her...

she had no more t, or psych. that ended at the hospital,...and all the bullsht was coming back... 50 calls a day to me.. where am i , what am i doing...

she came to my house.. and i didnt want to sleep with her... i wanted her to visit and go home..., and i was pulling back. to the point of the nasty messages,, and so on and so forth... i could not digest any that happended...the past months...

but i knew that what i thought was rock bottom ... was just a time out in the psych ward... she wanted to go tanning, and get the nails done... and shop...

and actions were showing she was still her...

so i walked away... i no longer felt guilty...

and the pysch ward was my closure...

she hadnt changed one bit...

and she was worse than ever... the rages.. the attidude, the fears of abandoment...

no more t , no more pysch... they wanted nothing to do with her after the susicide attempt...

so she was once again.. starting at gound zero...

just i had no more fight in me.. to help her again...i could not do it...

my mind would not let me...

i realised...

it was time to exit the roller coaster once again...


its been many months now... i dont think about it...i dont feel bad about it...

i had to protect myself...

i got my closure...

this was all a stunt.. but she punished me , whats left of her family and herself...

when i looked at her as a orphan... and not someone i wanted to share my life with...

where was it going...

so many wonder how i got so smart... its had to do with survival

learn by doing and not doing... paying attention to the voice in your head... and trusting you gut...

but listen to your first thought..the advise of others...

but mostly trust yourself... and dont let anyone take your selef away from you...

i traveled the first car on the roller coaster for 5 years...i got off i allowed her to drag me back on...

this all comes down to one thing in her case ...

maybe it applies to you...

you can make your s/o go for help, take the meds , read the books..

but they have to buy in to it... sincerely... with out you pushing...

casue of they dont want help... it dont change...ever

actions show... and you know when someone is trying and someones not...

for those in staying... yeah i was a stayer... i wanted her all better and maybe who knows... i would have walked right along side of her to get her straighted out...

but whe i was dragging her.. thru life...

she won... she defeated me...

but if she did what was required of her,,,,who knows.. maybe it wouldnt have ended like this...


so ... for those of you who were curious... .i did the best .. i could to recall... thwere was much more...  but she was 9 for 9 on the critera count...

i didnt cause it, it wasnt my disorder,,,

and i went above and beyond...in the fixing it... portion...


after the last drama... i went outside the gates,,,, brought a chain... and locked them closed...

bit this time was different... after i locked the gate... i didnt put the key in key in my pocket... i threw it into the fields...


any questions feel free...











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« Reply #37 on: April 28, 2008, 02:33:35 PM »

that's a story and 1/2...went through a few rounds of popcorn...thanks for sharing this.  That's a hell of an account.

2 things...one an observation and then a quesiton


she won... she defeated me..."

I don't see it that way.  Ultimately, you did what was required to get your life back.  Staying ='d down for the count.  In doing so, you are able to give back to someone healthy (one day-when u choose)  and of yourself in other ways (here, friends, you have your family back, too!).  Staying was killing you.  U weren't defeated. 

...

then the question...does she STILL re-engagement?   
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« Reply #38 on: April 28, 2008, 02:42:53 PM »

she still dont get it... and wont accpet the fact...im gone...

she even blamed me for the psych ward...

in her mind... i left her...and forced her to continue her self inflicted hell on her self...

and for nine months she was with new b.f , kicked out of friends, daughters... lost her jobs...and went to the pscyh ward...

becuase...

i cut her loose...and probably to this day...

its all my fault... and she she doent think back.. there is no self reflection..

she dont have rear view mirrors... so there is no regrets... of thinking...

if she read this story she would say ... did i really do that...?

so when things are going well for her... or she thinks they are... im not in her head...

but when things start... who better to call than the one who tried to fix her for 5 years..

everyone else ran ... and spit on the ground she walked on...

but i always had the broom and the glue to fix it...





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« Reply #39 on: April 28, 2008, 02:50:57 PM »

no, she would say...I did not do that!
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« Reply #40 on: April 28, 2008, 02:54:56 PM »

saraband... months after she disapaeared that night...

she cought up with me...  ir something...during one of her re-engagements..

she was having thing about me dating.. someone...

i looked at her and said ?

i wasnt waiting for you... you disaapeard into the night...

and then she looked at me and said...

oh yeah i forgot...
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« Reply #41 on: April 28, 2008, 02:55:58 PM »

Your story has reinforced the fact that as much as we want to help the BP sufferer, that they are the ones who have to want to do it. It has to be for the right reason, for themselves. I tried to quit smoking a number of times, and failed and failed and failed, but I was doing it for all the wrong reasons. Once I decided to do it for me, so that I would feel better, I was successful. That was 10 years ago, and I haven't looked back. To start smoking again would be like admitting failure to me, and I won't admit failure again.

Saving a BP who won't admit or commit to change is useless in the same way. They may go through the motions, but if they aren't working the program, then they aren't going to change. They will continue with the same behavior and attitudes.

Conversely, for those of us trying to be the saviors, we have to know when we have also reached the end. What is our breaking point? How do we know when we have given it our all and have nothing left to give? It is different for each of us, and no amount of warnings or threats can do it for us. We have to go through the experience ourselves. It isn't enough to be told, "the stove is hot. Don't touch or you'll get burned!". We have to be the ones who feel the heat, sometimes more than once before we can accept the truth.  

This place is great, for the support and acceptance that is offered. You never really hear "I told you so." What you hear is, we understand.

Thank you Tony - for the support you freely offer. Your words help many more than you realize.

((((((((( round of applause ))))))))))))))
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« Reply #42 on: April 28, 2008, 02:58:41 PM »

This reminds me of my ex (last year)  

I was moving down to Jupiter Beach.  We were going to have the opportunity to spend more time together.  I thought things were going ok.  Then she calls and says..."I can't  Let's see where we are in 6 months and reevaluate, but No Contact)  I knew what I was dealing with so, I said...'Ok, that's your choice but I am moving on with my life...not holding out for what could be.

Then months go by and she sees me out with a girl...she's visibly pissed.  Later I run into her and she says "I can't believe you didn't wait. See you already cheated.  You hurt me"  

This is one of the first times I really realized that their (BPD) logic is all about crazymaking then 0 accountability.  It just wasn't worth it.  

Sorry...I was just sharing a similar exp.  this isn't my thread.

But she is STILL re-engaging?  Argh!  :Smiling (click to insert in post)



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« Reply #43 on: April 28, 2008, 03:08:02 PM »

...and probably to this day...

its all my fault... and she she doent think back.. there is no self reflection..

she dont have rear view mirrors... so there is no regrets... of thinking...

if she read this story she would say ... did i really do that...?

Same here, Tony.  I learned that from my little road trip into crazyland this weekend.  No self reflection, no rear view mirrors...no regrets, only blame and excuses and how I have caused his life to crumble. 

In a way I guess that's true, because I was the only thing holding the puzzle together so the rest of the world couldn't see who he really is...and now that I'm gone, so are the kids and the charade of who he pretended to be to the outside world. 

Like you, if exh would have stepped up to the plate and done the right thing, the hard thing, admitted the problem is him and really done the work of seeking recovery, then who knows?

The orphan thing-I get that too.  Pathetic, just a miserable and pathetic, but still self-inflicted, way to live.
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« Reply #44 on: April 28, 2008, 03:08:32 PM »

duet you cant be in the sole caretaker mode it dont work... i tried and tried...

the weekly this is good this is bad talks...

it was like trying to talk to a toddler in a 45 y/o body...

if they step up... and do what they are required,and you know they do,...

you got the ground work in place...you have a foundations...,

mike     during her stay in the hospital...

she askes how many women have you been with i said a few..

she said more than 2...i said yup...

i said why dont we leave that... alone...

she was starting to carry on... i said more than you want to know about...

she started her sht...i said you ditched me in the middle of the night...you went and liveed with some guy for many months...

same answer...

oh yeah your right... but its not the same...?
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« Reply #45 on: April 28, 2008, 07:25:04 PM »

Tony

YOu have an art for telling a stories.  And this was a profound one.  Thanks.
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« Reply #46 on: April 28, 2008, 07:37:41 PM »

The only thing scarier than watching someone you know is Borderline act crazy is watching someone you don't realize is Borderline act crazy. You've had both experiences, which adds a whole other interesting layer to it.

Thanks for sharing.

I'm sorry you had to go through that all, but glad you're out of it and here safe with your friends.

--J
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« Reply #47 on: April 28, 2008, 09:30:28 PM »

Tony, Tony, Tony...feeling a bit cleansed?

Hopefully by recanting your story it has purged any remaining toxins left inside of you!

I think what draws us to you Tony is that most of us envision you as this big "soprano" like kind of New Yorker.  You know that whole what you see is what you get attitude.  But when we read through your tough and wise crackin' posts, we see a very wise old soul who is a bit of a softie.  You walked through the fire and you stared down the beast and conquered it.

It gives us all hope that we too will conquer that borderline beast that took hold of our loved one.   

oneflewover   
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« Reply #48 on: April 29, 2008, 12:17:46 PM »

Tony - here's a big manhug!  xoxo

Again, I'm wicked late to the party on this one, but I really appreciate you taking the time and courage to share your story like this.  The simultaneous toughness, wit, and sensitivity you demostrate are a constant wonder.  You are a real mensch and a model for those of us who are just starting on the path of rebuilding.  I don't have anything substantive to say that the other folks haven't, but I just wanted to thank you.
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« Reply #49 on: April 29, 2008, 12:52:44 PM »

no problem... so this should answer the what was your past like questions.. Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

there is tuff i didnt even put in... cause ...i had a real problem with the sequence.. or timing...

i did remember some thing this morning...

we are at her therapist...

he sat across from us...

i would give him a written weekly recap...he asked for me to do this.. cause he knew she lied...

so he says to her...

why did you feel like you had to start a fight with the neighbor.. cause there kids were being loud..

she put on the face... stood up... yelled

you two are supposed to treat me different i have BPD

she stormed out...slammed the door..

we just sat there for about 30 seconds..in silence staring at each other...

then i said .. you saw it right?

he said... ohhh yeaah , the face, the whole thing... scary sht tony

i said i know...

i got to go retrieve her.. before she beats up you secratary...

later doc...

hey i can laugh about this now...
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« Reply #50 on: April 29, 2008, 12:59:05 PM »

Holey moley!

Years ago I think they just kept people like that chained up in the attic.

--J
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« Reply #51 on: April 29, 2008, 01:57:36 PM »

Or burned them at the stake...
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« Reply #52 on: April 29, 2008, 02:03:46 PM »

...or drove a stake in their heart.    :P
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« Reply #53 on: April 29, 2008, 02:06:20 PM »

...or set them up on a date with me?

--J
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« Reply #54 on: April 29, 2008, 02:07:33 PM »

...or set them up on a date with me?

--J

Unless of course they are male. Then I'm the lucky recipient!
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« Reply #55 on: May 01, 2008, 02:21:51 PM »

Excerpt
and the pysch ward was my closure...

Yeah, that was my rock bottom. There's something about seeing them in a hospital gown walking around in a trans-like state on meds. I realized he was beyond any help. Off meds he was out of control, on meds he was drinking heavily so they weren't effective. He was a mess and I was forced to take a long hard look at that.

Many who stay may not have hit the point of no return, but even before my ex ended up in the pysch ward he was extremely unstable for a year and needed intervention. I was kidding myself... beginning to get used to the insanity and staying numb for the sake of triggering him. And the ultimate mistake you can polute yourself with is thinking you can fix this. Realistically, you can't.

He still doesn't 'get it' either. He thinks I have a communication problem I didn't want to work on. Things didn't happen like I say...  I never listen to him or want to see his point of view and the two therapists I seen didn't help me at all. 

Tony,

Before the post is locked, thanks for starting this post. I almost forgot the pysch ward visit since he is now taking care of himself and acting fine. I'd swear he was cured if I didn't know about BPD which also can make the re-engagements hard on people who just got out.





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« Reply #56 on: May 01, 2008, 02:31:23 PM »

the psych ward sucked...it was a waste of time...

and when thought this is it... it cant get anyworse... maybe this is what we needed to finally have this work..

i saw it was just a time out...

i took her home to her daughters... and she made a list..

that night..

some new clothes

money for tanning..

take me out to dinner

let me stay over.

oh yea im low on pills take me to get some..

she now had no t no shrink... they dropped her... wanted nothing to do with her..

she said they sucked anyway...and hated them, and hated her family for not chacking on her for a month...

and i was once again... standing alone... on a big pile of eggshells...

and there i was ...that knot was forming...but i didnt look at her the same way...i saw a ship... taking on water fast...

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« Reply #57 on: May 01, 2008, 03:02:35 PM »

and there i was ...that knot was forming...but i didnt look at her the same way...i saw a ship... taking on water fast...

Thank God!
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« Reply #58 on: May 01, 2008, 03:19:46 PM »

Yup...the psych ward...that is pretty much the nail in the coffin...

DB checked himself in a couple times...so strange to me that his family can still chugg along like there isn't anything really wrong with him...as long as he's not in their hair I suppose...

Tony...your story is pretty amazing really considering you have come out the other side of OZ and you are still a gentle, loving, amazing, witty soul...it does prove there is life after...

I'm very proud to call you friend...

For all the eggshells...you have walked on...

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« Reply #59 on: May 01, 2008, 03:42:08 PM »

you know elph.. there plenty more .. but i five years turned into .. one long bad dream...

i can only remeber things buy the seasons.. like it was cold out...it was oct nov or dec.

or it was hot...it was july or sug..., or a holiday...

you know what got me stuck with the guilt after nine months of not seeing her.. except for the re-engagement visits...that i was able to deal with...and the cops and all that...

when she was in the pysch ward..for 2 months?

no visitors...no calls... no nothing...

not her son... the daughter came once and a while...

her family... had no clue...

she forced everyone to abandon her...and had the nerve to call me to rescue her..

it was just me...i would leave after a visit..look up at the window...she would be looking at me too...and i  would feel my eyes fill up...cause i dont know...i was scared...she had my heart in her hands...and she was pulling on it..and it was only a matter of time.. before she yanked it out and held it up like a trophy..then tossed it too the ground and stepped on it...

i felt like...or i knew  i was going to have to walk away again...or the person i loved .. i was leaving locked up in a psych ward...

but .. when she came out and nothing had changed...it was horrible for her to drag me back to come to the rescue...and i could not rescue her from,, herself...

this is going to be locked up soon...

im hoping some of you know where i come from..and my struggles.. and maybe you see yourself in parts of this...so you know. how it started and how it finished...

and if you wonder how i can predict.. and guess your s/o next move..

now you know...

and maybe...you can see the after... if you visit rebuilding...

i will tell you about my new life..on the other side...

tony...
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« Reply #60 on: May 01, 2008, 06:15:36 PM »

Thanks for sharing, Tone. Glad to hear you're in a better place now.
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« Reply #61 on: May 01, 2008, 07:25:25 PM »



Tony,

You are such a tremendous person.  Simply put:  a really great guy.  Your new gf, any woman actually, is lucky to have you in their life.

I was reflecting on the responses you received here on the board while you were going through some of those experiences.  The one that really comes to mind is the psych ward.  I don't know how many people gave you such solid advice about her motives and intentions while she was in the cuckoo house.  Yet, you stuck by her knowing that you had to do the "right" thing by her.  And when you saw it was time to go - you left. 

You did what you had to do.  Just like so many others at bpdfamily.com.  Going through the same pain that you've been through before.  Going through the same motions that you've gone through before.  All the while hearing from the side-lines to "move on" "let go" "take care of yourself".

You are such a selfless individual who deserves a special place in heaven.  With a bunch of women who are worthy of you (& you of them).  Smiling (click to insert in post) 8) :-*
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