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Author Topic: 5.05 | Relationship recycling [romantic partners]  (Read 64997 times)
twistedmarriage
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« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2011, 10:23:49 PM »

 Shout out! PDQuick

I now feel empowered with these words of wisdom...look at the BPD as a whole person ..so accept that Hyde and Jekyll are on and the same...with ultimately the same motivations..

power lies within the non...the BPD just keeps looping..finally I think I get it.  So what causes a BPD to move forward? The lack of response and drama?  I could never understand why my uBPDh was not happy with his first wife...beautiful, funny, great mom/wife who never questioned his actions or demanded his attention..but I guess thats why when I appeared (his angel he lied to say...a halo of light around me -but now I'm a "2-bit whore") on the scene he thought I was his savior...that he could rely on me to protect him and support him...make him feel desired and important because I "validated" him or engaged with him...and of course since I was a successful career woman then all the better...so he probably felt "safe" about jumping ship to sail with me...which was totally shocking to his first wife as she was used to his "recycling"...he had left a few times before..so she really did not believe that he was gone until he skipped out on his son's football game to hang out with me...(light bulb shining brighter)...and his immediate family did not believe it either and probably remained supportive of the first wife because they probably thought his affair with me would blow over...as all the other affairs had. But no one, including him, realized how determined I was to believe that the world was not filled with men like my NPD father...so I chose to view him through rosy glasses and treated him like he was a victim ...a victim of his parents and first wife...he convinced me that they never really cared about him...and pure ignorance had me up the ante even more when I

suggested that we all meet to discuss the issues at hand and to reassure his family and first wife that I had no interest in taking what was theirs.   So his BPD mind then had to quickly strangle any possibility of everyone getting along and so instead starts telling me that his family said horrific things about me.  (what I should of asked  myself back then was why would he encourage animosity between all of us if he was really serious about his "soulmate love for me?  And now when I'm ready to divorce if it can be peaceful he needs to drum up some drama so that he does not need to take responsibility for the r/s ending...he never did file for divorce with his first wife..she filed...and a month later when I snooped into his wallet he still had her photo and love notes displayed (in his wallet).  Wow!

Very interesting and very insightful thread.  Thank you all for sharing your wisdom and to help me grow.  
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diotima
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« Reply #41 on: October 24, 2011, 12:13:04 AM »

Quote
I think that a good rule of thumb, is that if they cannot articulate WHY they left you in the first place, in a way that makes sense to someone else besides you (because you could be in denial), then you have to face the real possibility that they don't understand why they left you and they are only compelled to repeat (ie, recycle) their behavior.

Yes, a thread full of good insights. I think I overlooked this many times, i.e., my ex not being able to articulate. When he tried to re-engage and clearly said he wanted me back he would then say that he didn't know what he wanted--I think he said that every time he also said he wanted me back. He said it the last time when I finally said no, and I am still wondering whether if I knew what I now know (about BPD) when he asked whether we could get past our "impasses"  something could have changed. Probably not, since the impasse from my side was the other women he chased as soon as he dysregulated. I am not so sure that he could get past that particular impasse. I know I cannot, but there is this lingering doubt in my mind because I refused to even discuss it because I was so hurt. I feel like it was my last chance to say: there has to be T. I then went NC. I don't know.

Diotima
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knowing
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« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2011, 02:50:30 PM »

VERY helpful workshop!  Looking back on our recycling (until i found this board), i admit i was generally the one who initiated re-engagement.  this board has helped me so much in seeing what *i* need to do for myself on my own end in terms of validation, etc., rather than hoping that Dr. Jekyll can come through for me (in hopes that Mr. Hyde would not reappear).  i am so thankful to all the members on this board who helped me see that i was STUBBORNLY holding onto an illusion of what i wanted our marriage to be, holding up blinders to all that was dysfunctional, violent, draining and destructive.
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Currently reading:  Can't Live With 'Em, Can't Live Without 'Em:  Dealing with the LOVE/HATE Relationships in Your Life by Stephen Arterburn MEd & David A. Stoop PhD
Changed4safety
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« Reply #43 on: November 28, 2011, 11:10:34 PM »

Wow...in the process of breaking up with my BPDbf.  There have been many breakups along the lines of "I hate you!  We're done!" and then three hours later we tacitly agree that Nothing Happened.  Except every single time, I believed and grieved.  I guess I sure didn't learn.

We tried and tried--he really did do a lot of work on himself, and so did I, but it's not going to be enough.  He's also bipolar and has PTSD, yippee.  And over the last few weeks as we deal with living together, still loving each other and wanting to stay friends...I am realizing a lot about what I want and don't want.  I do fear the breakup--not so much true recycling but as has been mentioned here, inappropriate contact (he still wants to hang out and watch movies and TV, he still anticipates us playing online games together, and worst of all, I know he still anticipates me paying for things.  It's very, very hard to put down boundaries on that, and I'm hurting to the tune of having maxed out my cards and lost about $60K over the last few years trying to placate insatiable needs.)

We are seeing a therapist, I will bring up what my boundaries are and state them in front of a witness as it were about what is and isn't acceptable.  He takes meds and is a type I diabetic, so he could play the "I need my insulin" card.  I really hope not. 

Man, I am not looking forward to this, but I would rather deal with this than the violence, fear, and well...there it is, FOG. 

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sm15000
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« Reply #44 on: February 13, 2012, 12:25:45 PM »

Quote
I think that a good rule of thumb, is that if they cannot articulate WHY they left you in the first place, in a way that makes sense to someone else besides you (because you could be in denial), then you have to face the real possibility that they don't understand why they left you and they are only compelled to repeat (ie, recycle) their behavior.

I ended it but i could tell him why. . .he could never articulate why his behaviour towards me and hence our relationship changed so dramatically and was now filled with manipulation, lies, mistrust and doubt.  Just kept going around and around in circles, was involved with other women, but seemed to be thinking/hoping he could get away with it.

Quote
Probably not, since the impasse from my side was the other women he chased as soon as he dysregulated.



This is how i feel. . .i think i could have dealt with all of his other BPD behaviours, knowing what i do now. . .but not the constant doubt of if he dysregulates, he'll be cheating.  As i've recovered i hold no false hopes of any intimate relationship with him. . .but i still miss the person and i deeply regret that it feels like we have ended on bad terms because of the need of NC.
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diotima
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« Reply #45 on: February 13, 2012, 07:18:02 PM »

Hmmm, I notice that my last post on this thread was in November and it is now February. No way do I want that BP crap back in my life. I do miss the good parts but there is no way my ex could have ever learned how not to be a serial cheater. He was incapable of emotional learning of any kind. Good riddance.

Diotima
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Marvin Martian
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« Reply #46 on: April 21, 2012, 08:00:39 PM »

I think what makes it so hard for me to stop "recycling" - if indeed that's what I've been doing - is the knowledge (reasonably sure - I'm more confident about it than many other things that I "know") that what drives the breakups or bad spells is mental disorder.

Because if something is driven by disorder, then there is always the possibility that upon, ah, re-ordering, that things will get better. That possibility is especially tantalizing when the person in question is your wife of many years, and the mother of your children.

So I don't think it's quite as simple as just hoping foolishly that a leopard will not have spots. I think it's more like hoping that a person who coughs on you all the time might eventually stop (or diminish) the coughing, with proper treatment.

Auspicious, your word were pretty helpful. I do accept that she isn't two persons, but one that can get a bit dys-regulated, and tipped over. But at times when she is working on things [like after she read high conflict couple] she is amazing. Yes she is really that amazing. But it is what it is today, and sometimes things are rough, but there is always hope for the future. And with hope and effort, skill, and understanding, she may be freed from the disorder, just in  the way people can recover from a physical ailment.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2012, 08:05:05 AM by an0ught, Reason: Fixed quoting » Logged
tailspin
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« Reply #47 on: April 22, 2012, 12:12:59 PM »

We recycle to validate ourselves based upon the mistaken belief that external validation is the only truth.  Once we realize personal validation is the only truth...then the need to be validated from an external source is extinguished.

I wanted him to want me again because I didn't believe I was worthy of being loved in the first place.  I was seeking something from him that didn't exist outside of myself.  I was seeking validation from a person that wasn't even capable of giving validation to himself.

We cannot expect anyone to give us anything we aren't willing to give ourself and this is true regardless if the relationship is healthy or disfunctional.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2012, 12:24:33 PM by tailspin » Logged

"I am not what happened to me, I am what I choose to become.” ― C.G. Jung
eyvindr
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« Reply #48 on: September 16, 2012, 04:09:15 PM »

So much hard-earned and seriously good insight in this workshop thread.
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"Being deceived in effect takes away your right to make accurate life choices based on truth." -- waverider

"Don't try the impossible, as you're sure to become well and truly stuck and require recovery." -- Vintage Land Rover 4X4 driving instructional video
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« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2015, 10:53:06 PM »

Although this is quite an old workshop, I'll post anyway as there's one category that is missing (I think).

From a lot of reading it sounds like many BPD partners are highly intelligent and can reason/debate very well.  This makes it hard to decide whether to recycle because even if you have decided to get out, they come back around with such persuasive insights and arguments that it makes you think that they have grown, have attained some level of self-awareness.   However, in my personal experience, if you look behind the arguments (which seem to avoid acknowledgement of the personal hurt they have inflicted on the non), there is very little substance or action to back it up.   You might get a "I'm sorry I hurt you" but the rest will be blaming the breakup on joint issues (imaginary or not) regarding communication and even faults attributed to you. If you have to re-engage (and I strongly encourage you not to), then have a clear idea of what concrete steps or actions that person needs to take before you'll get dragged back in.   

I think the one most vulnerable in the recycle scenario are those that have done everything in their power (moving mountains) to maintain and save the relationship yet are left high and dry without closure nonetheless.   They will be among the ones hurting the most and any re-engagement with a halfway plausible excuse for why the BPD left gives them one small straw to clutch at. 

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