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Author Topic: She often used the phrase ' I was brought up differently to you'  (Read 2595 times)
Andy1963
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« on: October 26, 2020, 07:51:34 AM »

I know she had quite a strict upbringing
Her mother was a very dominating person who had very strict conservative views and , according to my ex, made her fathers life a misery
She sent my ex away to have an abortion when she got pregnant at 18, she was given no say in the matter.
I know this deeply affected her, but I picked up various clues throughout our relationship of how dominant her mother was
Strange to remember now that she often used the phrase ' I was brought up differently to you' whenever we had disagreements about basic fundamental things
How entrenched she would get in a thought process or a perspective and there was no shifting her from it no matter what I said or however much I reassured her
« Last Edit: October 26, 2020, 11:30:44 AM by once removed » Logged
Andy1963
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« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2020, 03:34:49 PM »

Reading a lot at the moment
Understanding the inner child
My codependency,  how that has enhanced my sense of loss
I think of her now not as she was when we were in a good place, but rather as a toxic part of me
I remind myself that the relationship couod not have survived as long as it did had it not been for my codependent nature
She admitted many times that were it not for my resilience we would have broken up long before we did
However, i dont see it as resilience,  but weakness, codependency and my lack of self and self awareness
I need to repair so much about me to truly heal
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Goosey
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« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2020, 09:26:01 PM »

Strangely I feel better about the whole ugly end of my marriage.
And I shouldn’t dwell on this but reading about gifts is so telling. 
I came to dread Christmas. No matter what I bought her it was always the same reaction. The careful opening of the gift. The short look at it and the drop back into the box. Not even a thank you.
  But the best(worst) was the reaction I got after I sent her flowers for her birthday over a year ago. We had split up by then.
But I spent an hour with her at a park and we had a calm packed lunch and a short walk in a nature center. After we left she was driving and became enraged and punched the crap out of me while driving like a lunatic. Somehow I got dropped off shell shocked. The next day I sent her the flowers. (? Ya like really).
I got a voice message a couple days later ranting that there was no card and they weren’t even her favorite kind and they died! 
I just kinda laugh now.  I mean they are cut flowers. 
   I don’t understand most of what could be bpd. I just know I had become the enemy and none of my begging for understanding would get me anywhere.
  She’ll be fine. We had a twenty year run and she is kind of a magnet. And I’ll be ok I think now. Time does help. Reflection does help. Forgiveness helps. And a bit of understanding of the hell she may feel makes me sad but I have to survive also.
  The one line in walking on eggshells just was so sad. How the emotions theY  feel is like their skin Is on fire.
I do believe that. I have witnessed it. And it’s so sad.
 Anyway.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2020, 04:07:04 AM »

Today is 4 weeks NC
I still have urges most days to contact her and I've yet to block her
But I'm staying NC, this site has been a godsend to me
Thankyou
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Andy1963
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« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2020, 01:23:24 PM »

4 weeks and 3 days since no contact and she has sent me a message
Asking if I want some junk i left in her garage
Haven't replied yet, we have a a conversation about this before and I made it clear I don't need the stuff
Should I reply?
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Andy1963
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« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2020, 01:36:12 PM »

Ironically this was the day I had said to myself, I now have the strength to block
Are they psychic?
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2020, 01:37:48 PM »

Hey Andy-

You’ve made it clear before that you don’t need the things in her garage.  Once is enough, correct?

You’re working hard on your healing, and in gaining an understanding on the “whys” of you.

Use care to not allow anyone or anything stand in the way of your path to healing.  Least of all what may on its face appear as a “harmless” text from your ex.

This is YOUR path.  Not hers to block.

Warmly,
Gems
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« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2020, 01:41:41 PM »

Since you made it clear before that you don’t want the stuff and it’s a trivial non emergency event it seems like trolling to me.
I get those once and a while.
  It’s hard to not respond but I have not responded and nothing ever comes of it.
  Doubt she is waiting for a response anyway.  This does get easier.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2020, 01:42:41 PM »

I have a few things of hers and I've been tempted to ask her if she wants them, but my guess is she wouldn't
Can't believe today of a days, my absolute strongest day so far,  that this happens
So bizarre
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Andy1963
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« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2020, 01:44:43 PM »

Thanks for the replies
Greatly appreciated
I know the best response is none
Just a bit taken aback...
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Goosey
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« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2020, 01:48:46 PM »

And I don’t think my ex was physic haha But I understand why it can seem that way.  
  Remember that you are spending all your time thinking of them so it’s not a stretch her “call” is when you are struggling with the whole thing.
  
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Andy1963
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« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2020, 06:00:51 PM »

Ok, so I didn't reply
Now a second message,  asking if I'm ok?
So here it starts , is this her trying to reel me back in?
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Goosey
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« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2020, 07:13:38 PM »

Sounds like it.
Keep the faith.
Doing nothing is not a crime.
Let it ride.
... and try (I know it’s very hard) to focus on what has transpired in the past. And then try to logically think (again very very hard) if you want to live like that.
  This does get easier.
 Everyone involved just get bored with it if there is no scrambled mess. They move on.
It’s hard but I am going through it and the noise drops to About zero with a bit of self control to not engage.
Again. It’s hard! 
And the maybe coming (again) discard is hard.
Just letting time pass without doing anything is just time passing.
  And I know when I state”gets bored with it” I sound condescending. I was a bit taken aback when someone posted that. (Apologies for my plagiarism). I did find it is true. At some point of disconnecting it happens. Painfully slow but it does happen.
   
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2020, 07:25:53 PM »

Hey Andy-

It does appear to me that she’s making an attempt to recycle- dipping her toes in to test the temp of the water.

My friend, you’re early in your recovery and it’s so vital for you to NOT allow these distractions to derail your progress.

How about you block her for this evening, or for this weekend?  Change the settings on your phone so that she cannot tell whether or not you’ve read her messages. 

And then maybe do something, anything to divert your attention for some hours.  Put a stay on the ruminations for a bit.  Watch a comedy maybe?  Telephone a good friend and talk for a bit?  Watch a few comedians on you tube? 

You KNOW why you’re out.  You KNOW why you’re working so hard.  You KNOW how your pain feels.  Right?

Your thoughts?

Warmly,
Gems
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Andy1963
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« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2020, 07:31:39 PM »

The thing is, had this been two weeks ago I would have replied in a heartbeat
And who knows what would have come of it
But I've got such a strong support network around me  with you all on here, my brother who pulls no punches, and my best friend who basically said if I get back in touch with her he is disowning me
He's much more important to me than she is, at least I realise that now
So im staying strong

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Andy1963
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« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2020, 07:34:37 PM »

And I can't thank all of you enough for your insight and inspiration
Thankyou
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Goosey
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« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2020, 07:37:39 PM »

Good you have the network.
  Lean in on them.
Your not doing wrong by protecting yourself.
That can be a hard one to realize. I felt selfish and disloyal and oh whatever but at some point self preservation kicks in.
   And believe you me the other will be just fine.
Amazing resilient they are.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2020, 07:41:10 PM »

Thankyou Goosey
Im so conscious that the last few days have been so much better for me
Ironic that she should choose now to contact
Im guessing her new supply isn't up to the mark
Im starting to breathe, sleep and live again
Don't need this anymore
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Goosey
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« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2020, 07:45:44 PM »

Keep the faith.
We only get one go around in this life.
Take care.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2020, 07:50:27 PM »

You're so right
There were weeks were I checked my phone regularly to see if she had messaged
Then just when I had moved away from that she does
Its bizarre,  but, im absolutely resisting
As my brother said , stop empowering her
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Andy1963
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« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2020, 07:53:08 PM »

What strikes me is that this interaction has rendered me impotent in terms of intelligent dialogue
Its as if she strips me bare of any ability tk form cognitive and rational argument
What is going on there?
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Goosey
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« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2020, 08:09:08 PM »

Let me guess.
Are you given the time to reply?
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Goosey
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« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2020, 08:13:19 PM »

My life was scrambled frantic really pathetic in retrospect mess for several years.
  In retrospect I am ashamed I let myself devolve into that morass of incivility.
  Just step back your in control of you.
Take the advise of other on this blog and your support.
Take a breather and do anything to live vicariously of it all for a bit.
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2020, 08:30:01 PM »

Andy (and all of us)-

We Are recovering from abusive relationships, regardless of whether our former partners were diagnosed or not.  Regardless of whether they ever delivered apologies or not.  Their behaviors were abusive.

And I believe after we spend time in these relationships, and absorb repeated abuse (although at the time, we generally don’t recognize it as “abuse” per se), our entire being is affected in a huge way.  We lose trust in ourselves along the way.  In ever knowing the right thing to say, to do, how to respond; our natural facial expression can set off a string of vulgarities and soul-crushing insults.

Andy - your wounds are so so fresh.  You need to allow yourself time to regain your footing, your confidence, your trust in yourself.   And you’ll reconcile how you truly feel about her, her constant belittling, her lashing out and her deceitful behavior. 

You’re allowed to let your feelings settle.   You’re allowed time for your own clarification.   The purpose of this contact from her (in my opinion) is to keep her fresh in your mind.  She wants you as an option.  I experienced this constantly.  I am NO LONGER an “option” for him.  My choice.

In my opinion, The benefit of NC (blocking in your case) is to give you the space for uninterrupted healing.  Even for a few weeks.  You’ll have your thoughts for sure without her input.  And you deserve that, don’t you?

And In time, you may find the desire to say to yourself “I don’t wish to know her anymore.”

My friend, after so much pain I learned that no matter how deeply I cared for him... no matter what I did, no matter what I sacrificed... I could NOT love him to wellness.  And neither can you.

Warmly,
Gems
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Goosey
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« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2020, 08:36:00 PM »

Thanks gems.
I needed that Reaffirmation also.
Have good weekend.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #25 on: October 31, 2020, 04:50:18 AM »

Thankyou Gems
Yes its so clear that she wants me as an 'option' I'm now relegated to the position a number of her other exes were when we were together , this was a common cause of conflict for us.
I couldn't at the time understand why she felt the need to hold onto these other guys when she had me in her life who was giving her absolutely everything
I now realise its all part of the condition, it all fits the pattern perfectly
Her contacting me actually underlines everything I've read and learned about this crazy condition
For weeks I maintained NC, daily i fought the urge to contact her, daily up until about a week ago, I would check my WhatsApp to see if she was active
Then, just as I'm truly emerging from all of that, she contacts me

I had thought it was one of two things

1. She just wanted to double check with me that I had no use for the things in her garage. I had thought, if that is the case and I don't reply, she will assume that anyway and no further contact is required.

2. She was using it as a soft approach to engage in conversation

Her follow up message more or less confirms that the second theory is the correct one
Do I take control of this and simply reply the following

'Yes I'm good thankyou,  I have no need for that stuff so feel free to dispose of it thanks'

Or is silence more powerful?...
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HopelessBroken
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« Reply #26 on: October 31, 2020, 12:06:14 PM »

Hello Andy!

Are you truly done with her? Truly, in your heart, never going back kind of done? Only you know this answer and it’s an important one.

If you are truly done, despite how painful this is, you do not reply and you block her from being able to contact you, starting now.

If you haven’t decided in your heart that you are done, then your polite reply answers her question about the stuff (which we know isn’t about the stuff).

What it is helpful to remember is when they reach out in these ways it isn’t about you. It’s about her and what she needs at the time.

But the damage is does is all about you. It can set you back into constant rumination, negative self talk and self doubt. Everything you have been working so hard against, so you can get yourself back.

I say all of this with a huge amount of compassion, I’ve been there.  With affection (click to insert in post)
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Andy1963
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« Reply #27 on: October 31, 2020, 01:21:00 PM »

HopelessBroken
I suppose the honest answer is I truly don't know
All I can say is that there are parts of me that miss her desperately,  there are days when I think about her a lot
But more and more and especially in this last week, my thoughts of her have diminished significantly
And those thoughts are more often than not, negative ones, memories of all the times she made me feel completely unloved and unwanted, only to apologise and recycle me
I completely know that it was a very toxic and damaging relationship for me and has left me with a lot of pain, and irreparable damage
Yet there is a part of me that still can't quite let go
I should have blocked her by now, i know that, it would have avoided this situation
But i now feel I'm two steps back
Ive  no idea what the future will hold
Im just hanging in and geting through each day
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« Reply #28 on: October 31, 2020, 02:24:47 PM »

All natural feelings.
  I think back on my years of personal turmoil and deep depression and ... ya all that ... and now kinda think what a sucker I was.
  I know my marriage and relationship are over.
  I don’t want to be in that type of relationship ever again.
 Yet.
   I still cycle a bit with ruminations.
 But it was UGLY and she was cruel and crude in the end so I will Never give her the satisfaction of me groveling and weeping for a moment of conversation anymore,  I will not
subject myself to her tired and untrue rants.
  I’m just bored with it. So if she pops up again with it I just hang up or don’t respond. 
  It’s B.s.— once the emotional bond lessens I can see it for what it is—- manipulation.
  Anyway she has new toys to play with. God help em.
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #29 on: October 31, 2020, 02:49:05 PM »

Hey Andy-

These are such complicated relationships.  And our exits are very difficult and filled with repetitive questions... over and over and over.  Mostly torturing ourselves.  Our former partners don’t seem to do that to themselves once they discard us.  Tho’ they seem to recall that we DO deliver some benefit(s) for them, so why NOT keep us on the hook?  My experience.  Many times over.  Until I made that final decision.

I had to make contact via text yesterday morning with my exBPD/NPDbf.  Have not heard his voice since his last despicable RAGE in February.  Have had no text contact since May.  The contact yesterday was brief, amicable, to the point.  Issue raised, issue addressed.  But... when I saw that a second (completely unnecessary) text from him came through about 10 minutes after the issue was settled, my entire body went to shaking.  It took me about a half hour to open it... he said “Sorry about that”.  I responded - “Appreciate that.  Take care.”  And that was that.

You’ve got to cut yourself some slack here.  You’re only 4 weeks NC.  A drop in the bucket.  So this is very fresh for you and your healing has just begun.

Bottom line is, you/I/we recognize the damage done to us.  And it’s pretty deep.  We know our hurts, our pain.  We KNOW the toxicity.  We need to understand how the abuse has truly affected us and that we CAN heal from it... in time.  But your abuser will NOT heal you.

And yes, you still miss things about her.  Why wouldn’t you?  I laughed more and was probably more myself with my exBPD/NPDbf than I’ve ever been with even my ex-husband.  And I was his “refuge”... his words.  But it didn’t matter.  And it doesn’t matter to me anymore.  I have worked hard to really see that I do not wish to know him anymore.

He’s not a kind or honest man.  And that’s not good enough for me.  I cannot step backwards and our communication is finished now that there are no more loose ends.

So if you feel vulnerable right now, take steps to lessen that for the next week, two weeks.  If that means blocking, do that.  You’ve got to help you.  She will NOT do it.  That is not where her interest lies.  And it never did.

Warmly,
Gems

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jaded7
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« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2020, 06:34:45 PM »

Thankyou Goosey
Im so conscious that the last few days have been so much better for me
Ironic that she should choose now to contact
Im guessing her new supply isn't up to the mark
Im starting to breathe, sleep and live again
Don't need this anymore

I've read much on bpd/npd, and read much here. Interestingly, a person who teaches about it says that when we are energetically connected to the abuser through our thoughts and feelings, we are still in IT. And when, as you did, you come to a place where you think I can step away energetically, they feel it and then know they are not in control anymore.

Sounds similar to what happened here. How are you doing. Funny, I would literally give anything to have her contact me...I'm in IT. And hello @GemsForEyes, nice to see your name here, you were such a support to me in the early days this spring.
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« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2020, 06:41:35 PM »

Hello Andy!

Are you truly done with her? Truly, in your heart, never going back kind of done? Only you know this answer and it’s an important one.

If you are truly done, despite how painful this is, you do not reply and you block her from being able to contact you, starting now.

If you haven’t decided in your heart that you are done, then your polite reply answers her question about the stuff (which we know isn’t about the stuff).

What it is helpful to remember is when they reach out in these ways it isn’t about you. It’s about her and what she needs at the time.

But the damage is does is all about you. It can set you back into constant rumination, negative self talk and self doubt. Everything you have been working so hard against, so you can get yourself back.

I say all of this with a huge amount of compassion, I’ve been there.  With affection (click to insert in post)

Beautiful answer...the outreach wasn't about how you are doing, it's about her, her needs.
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« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2020, 06:47:01 PM »

Andy (and all of us)-

We Are recovering from abusive relationships, regardless of whether our former partners were diagnosed or not.  Regardless of whether they ever delivered apologies or not.  Their behaviors were abusive.

And I believe after we spend time in these relationships, and absorb repeated abuse (although at the time, we generally don’t recognize it as “abuse” per se), our entire being is affected in a huge way.  We lose trust in ourselves along the way.  In ever knowing the right thing to say, to do, how to respond; our natural facial expression can set off a string of vulgarities and soul-crushing insults.

Andy - your wounds are so so fresh.  You need to allow yourself time to regain your footing, your confidence, your trust in yourself.   And you’ll reconcile how you truly feel about her, her constant belittling, her lashing out and her deceitful behavior. 

You’re allowed to let your feelings settle.   You’re allowed time for your own clarification.   The purpose of this contact from her (in my opinion) is to keep her fresh in your mind.  She wants you as an option.  I experienced this constantly.  I am NO LONGER an “option” for him.  My choice.

In my opinion, The benefit of NC (blocking in your case) is to give you the space for uninterrupted healing.  Even for a few weeks.  You’ll have your thoughts for sure without her input.  And you deserve that, don’t you?

And In time, you may find the desire to say to yourself “I don’t wish to know her anymore.”

My friend, after so much pain I learned that no matter how deeply I cared for him... no matter what I did, no matter what I sacrificed... I could NOT love him to wellness.  And neither can you.

Warmly,
Gems

Lovely response Gems. Your warmth comes through, as always. Yes, we have all been abusive relationships and have come to doubt ourselves and our blame ourselves for their behavior. I was just re-reading The Verbally Abusive Relationship (I read it a lot to get strength on bad days, and there are still many of them even though I'm 8 months into NC) and the confusion that abuse-verbal, emotional- causes can have us ruminating for months. Wondering if we are horrible people. Thinking we caused this )(because we were told that we were the cause of all the problems).

Thank Gems, your response brought a warm feeling to my heart, even though it wasn't for me.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #33 on: November 01, 2020, 05:11:01 AM »

Im really beginning to truly understand why blocking is so strongly advised on here
Those couple of messages,  however they were intended,  have completely thrown me off balance
Especially as i was having such a good couple of days
Been ruminating ever since, the dilemma as to what i should do
My head saying one thing , my heart something else
They are cruel cruel people...
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« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2020, 02:22:09 PM »

@goosey

I came to dread Christmas. No matter what I bought her it was always the same reaction. The careful opening of the gift. The short look at it and the drop back into the box. Not even a thank you.

My experience almost exactly. I don't understand it at all, when someone gives me a gift I think about them caring for me, the thought that went in to it, that we are sharing a special moment. Even if it's something I don't 'like', who cares? I want to show them I appreciate the thought.

My gf called my birthday gift "sh*tty" and "stupid" and I got it in the checkout line of a grocery store. She called me Christmas gift from over a year ago "a stupid book that I got in the checkout line at a grocery store" (not true, I want to a local boutique and spent an hour looking through things and found a book that had 60 walks in our town with history and tree identification and architecture types etc)...we loved to go on walks together through different neighborhoods and I thought this was a wonderful way to to acknowledge 'us' and to have something we could plan and do together, to build memories. When she got it she was completely unreactive, then a YEAR later she didn't invite me to Christmas (this past one) because "You want to know why I didn't invite you up this year? I remember that sh*tty book you got me last year and I didn't want to have to cover up for you in front of my family again!"

Our first birthday together I got her an $85 foot spa treatment, took her on a kayaking day trip, and bought her a $150 dinner. She was grouchy and pissed during dinner, when we went to bed that night I pulled up to her and kissed her neck and she acted cold and distant, I asked her if she just wanted to go to sleep and she snapped "What do you want? If you want sex, touch me in a sexy way!" This from the woman who would point at me to and snap at me to take off my clothes when she wanted sex.

As I mentioned, 15 months after I got her the foot spa treatment I called them and they told me she never used it.

Last year she forgot my birthday, brought a tin of cookies "as penance" when she came back from her trip. For Christmas that year she bought a magazine subscription online. Of course, I cherished both...why wouldn't I?

But this is woman who berated me and and my gifts, held a grudge for a year about one, and told me I put "zero effort and zero planning" into the second birthday with her when we were camping. And 5 weeks earlier had completely forgotten my birthday..while I was keeping her dog for the 3 weeks, after planning the whole trip out to the hour.

The hypocrisy and the downright rudeness around gifts...my god. Stunning. I simply don't and cannot understand it.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2020, 06:41:15 PM »

I truly feel as if I'm back to square one
After weeks of NC and focusing on myself her messages have blown a hole in everything
My rational thinking and reasoning have disappeared
Im an emotional wreck and I've no idea how to get back on track
I wish I had blocked her, I was going to do it on the very day she messaged
Its like she knew that and fired her bullet to stop it
The pain that had eased is now severe again
Lower than ive been for weeks now
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« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2020, 07:57:30 PM »

Dear Andy-

Yes, you feel extremely low right now.  And yes, you naturally feel that all the progress you’ve made has been wiped out.  Please try to have a bit of faith in yourself... that in fact tomorrow IS going to come and tonight’s severe pain may very well ease somewhat.  You can allow that to happen.

You DON’T have to feel like this.  You don’t.

I’m not sure if you’ve seen any of Dr. Ramani’s  You Tube videos on Narcissistic abuse.  There is one that may be especially helpful to you now (sorry I cannot link):  please google-  Dr. Ramani, narcissism ruminations.  That video helped me immensely to understand why I “thought” I couldn’t get him out of my head.

When I first found her videos, I binged and really entered my healing stage.  Those videos helped much more than my therapist at the time, who seemed to have little understanding/ empathy around the impacts of Narc abuse.

Finally my friend, please, for yourself, Block the contact.  You need and deserve the safety of the space.

Warmly,
Gems
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« Reply #37 on: November 02, 2020, 03:31:20 AM »

Thankyou Gems

I have watched a couple of Dr Ramani's videos as you suggested
The key thing for me is trying to get back to the realisation that there was absolutely nothing I could have done that would have saved this relationship
And believe me , I tried very very hard
I gave more of myself than I ever have in my entire life to make it work
I know that it drained me mentally and emotionally to the point where I had absolutely nothing more to give
The end of the relationship was probably enabled by me though
In the last few months I had started to try to get her to contribute more to it
To show me more that she actually did love me the way she kept professing
Her actions often belied her words so I started pulling away thinking this would make her realise and work harder for fear of losing me
Yet all this did was feed her fear of abandonment and I'm guessing this led to her seeking a new supply
I had tried so many different things to make the relationship work and to get her to contribute to it and nurture it as I always had
But I lost sight, foolishly, of the fact that her condition was the issue, not me, not anything I said or did, the condition was king
I need to remind myself every day what motivated me to pull away,
I remember her standing at my door looking at me, imploring me not to push her away, saying her heart was breaking, but I wanted her to stop and realise what I was asking for and just start loving me properly as normal people do
I now realise it was a futile exercise...


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« Reply #38 on: November 02, 2020, 03:34:04 PM »

Dear Andy-

Yes, you feel extremely low right now.  And yes, you naturally feel that all the progress you’ve made has been wiped out.  Please try to have a bit of faith in yourself... that in fact tomorrow IS going to come and tonight’s severe pain may very well ease somewhat.  You can allow that to happen.

You DON’T have to feel like this.  You don’t.

I’m not sure if you’ve seen any of Dr. Ramani’s  You Tube videos on Narcissistic abuse.  There is one that may be especially helpful to you now (sorry I cannot link):  please google-  Dr. Ramani, narcissism ruminations.  That video helped me immensely to understand why I “thought” I couldn’t get him out of my head.

When I first found her videos, I binged and really entered my healing stage.  Those videos helped much more than my therapist at the time, who seemed to have little understanding/ empathy around the impacts of Narc abuse.

Finally my friend, please, for yourself, Block the contact.  You need and deserve the safety of the space.

Warmly,
Gems

Thank you Gems for this. I just watched Dr. Ramani's video on ruminations, and it is so validating. As you can tell, I'm still in the ruminating stage 8 months into NC...my posts make that obvious! Frustrated/Unfortunate (click to insert in post) I'm self-aware enough to see that.

But the responses on the video, read them...everybody who is suffering with rumination, you will hear the EXACT same things you are thinking about, said by thousands of people. The EXACT same thoughts, the exact same questions, the exact same "maybe I should have done ____ differently.
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« Reply #39 on: November 04, 2020, 05:00:26 PM »

Just an update
Ive hit rock bottom and am really not in a good place
Reached out to a friend last night and he's tried to bring some perspective
But bottom line is I'm desperately unhappy and genuinely don't know how I can navigate the next few days...

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« Reply #40 on: November 04, 2020, 05:46:24 PM »

Just an update
Ive hit rock bottom and am really not in a good place
Reached out to a friend last night and he's tried to bring some perspective
But bottom line is I'm desperately unhappy and genuinely don't know how I can navigate the next few days...



Andy. I hear you. I've been there for months now. Find one thing you can do that distracts you or moves you life/goals forward. Anything. Go to the Dr. Ramani videos and listen to them...that's a step forward. She has a whole series. I'm listening right now in fact.

There were days in the last few months where I didn't want to go on, but I did using a minute-by-minute approach.
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« Reply #41 on: November 05, 2020, 05:08:18 PM »

Andy, we are all right here with you.

If you are ready...and willing...write for us below a list of things you did not like about her and negative ways she treated you.

We need to get your head and your heart matching up. Right now they are in different places. 
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« Reply #42 on: November 06, 2020, 08:59:33 AM »

The things I disliked about her
Every week there was a new drama in her life that needed immediate attention and everything had to be focused on that
Yet when I had something important to deal with she was dismissive and really not interested
In order for us to have a relationship it was necessary for me to involve myself with her family as two of her kids lived with her, however she refused to have anything to do with my children
My 16 year old has Aspergers and once in a rage that I was leaving her to go get him she called him a retard
Her inability to have rational argument, I felt like I was arguing with a child as would totally refuse to accept any fault in her position until after the event and even then it was only a mild acknowledgement that she quickly moved on from
Always when she would go into the dark place(as I called her glitches) she would verbally assault me highlighting every flaw and even making things up , suggesting I had said something a certain way when I absolutely hadn't
Her absolute refusal to ever accept responsibility for our constant conflict
I avoided it always and I was constantly walking on eggshells
Yet she always found away to create a disagreement, maybe something I said that she misunderstood or something I did, or something I didn't do, bearing in mind I did everything to try and make her happy
Her constant texts to ex boyfriends and continued communication with them despite me asking her to end such communication as , by her own admission, they only wanted her for sex
Her cheating with those exes and also I discovered two long term affairs she had had for many years including when she was with me, one was with a much older man who helped her out financially anytime she was short of money which she was often due to her spending addiction
Her irrational unpredictable behaviour at the smallest things, her rages, her cruelty, her scathing remarks about all those she felt were beneath her
She lacked humility, kindness and most of all, empathy
She used to ask me what it was I loved about her, and to be honest, I always evaded the question by asking it back to her
She would say it was my heart, my patience, how much she fancied me etc etc, then would say that she understood why I couldn't answer and would have went quiet
I could spend hours listing the various times she sent me home with a volley of abuse and nastiness, I used to say afterwards, you treat me like a piece of dirt , she seemed to be completely oblivious as to what was required to show love and respect to me
The list is endless...




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« Reply #43 on: November 06, 2020, 11:31:09 AM »

"No matter what I bought her it was always the same reaction. The careful opening of the gift. The short look at it and the drop back into the box. Not even a thank you.
  But the best(worst) was the reaction I got after I sent her flowers for her birthday over a year ago. We had split up by then.
But I spent an hour with her at a park and we had a calm packed lunch and a short walk in a nature center. After we left she was driving and became enraged and punched the crap out of me while driving like a lunatic. Somehow I got dropped off shell shocked. The next day I sent her the flowers. (? Ya like really).
I got a voice message a couple days later ranting that there was no card and they weren’t even her favorite kind and they died!
I just kinda laugh now.  I mean they are cut flowers. "

This is SO familiar!
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« Reply #44 on: November 06, 2020, 01:21:27 PM »

That is a LONG list of traits Andy.

Disrespectful, irresponsible, non-empathetic, unfaithful, unstable, unreliable, impulsive, double standards, dismissive.

I could say every one of these about my exBPD as well. This is a list of characteristics that we all want to avoid in a partner. Yet we all have felt at one time, that we couldn’t live without this person.

This is also a list of characteristics of a person who a relationship will not work with. No matter who the other person is. Which is why people with BPD unfortunately have a long history of broken relationships with friends, family and romantic partners.

Look over that list that you wrote (and I know it only touches the surface of things she did and ways she hurt you).  Not only do you have way too much self respect for that relationship, you will have healthy relationship where you get all the great things back that you give.  She unfortunately never will.

You can get through these really tough days. I PROMISE. When you are stuck in ruminations about her, check out that list you wrote. It will help your head and heart to get back on the same page.
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« Reply #45 on: November 06, 2020, 02:11:09 PM »

I hadnt realised until i wrote it down just how toxic and oppressive our relationship was.
And believe me,  thats the tip of the iceberg, i could tell things that would make people question my sanity for putting up with them.
I know completely that she will never change, her ex husband was constantly vilified by her yet he is happily remarried to a lovely girl so her demonisation of him now appears so false
I should have taken more notice of one of her friends( not a close friend, she had none of those) who said, she sucks the life out of men, dumps them and replaces them and you will be no different ...

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« Reply #46 on: November 06, 2020, 07:12:13 PM »

Wow.  This is all so familiar!   

I’m over on the boards for trying to save my marriage, but since my wife left 5 weeks ago she has blocked me and filed for divorce.  I suspect she has moved in with a man.  I came over here because I’m starting to lose hope of us getting back together. 

As far as the gifts go a few Christmas’s ago I bought my wife (we were living together but not married then) a set of amazing diamond earrings that cost about $1800.  I thought they were the best gift imaginable.  She was disappointed.  She liked them but she wanted an engagement ring.
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jaded7
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« Reply #47 on: November 07, 2020, 05:44:59 PM »

That is a LONG list of traits Andy.

Disrespectful, irresponsible, non-empathetic, unfaithful, unstable, unreliable, impulsive, double standards, dismissive.

I could say every one of these about my exBPD as well. This is a list of characteristics that we all want to avoid in a partner. Yet we all have felt at one time, that we couldn’t live without this person.

This is also a list of characteristics of a person who a relationship will not work with. No matter who the other person is. Which is why people with BPD unfortunately have a long history of broken relationships with friends, family and romantic partners.

Look over that list that you wrote (and I know it only touches the surface of things she did and ways she hurt you).  Not only do you have way too much self respect for that relationship, you will have healthy relationship where you get all the great things back that you give.  She unfortunately never will.

You can get through these really tough days. I PROMISE. When you are stuck in ruminations about her, check out that list you wrote. It will help your head and heart to get back on the same page.

That was an excellent idea for Any to write that out. Dr. Ramani recommends it, I have done journals of it. And yes, in my relationship outside observers (including 3 therapists, friends and family members) have told me that her treatment of me was

Disrespectful, irresponsible, non-empathetic, unfaithful, unstable, unreliable, impulsive, double standards, dismissive.


in a word, abusive. And I NEVER ONCE did anything to her. I would also include the words belittling, diminishing, condescending, dismissive

Yet, I understand where Andy is. I'm there too and can't get out of it. Dr. Ramani calls it
"the mind and the heart are in opposition". Exactly for me.

I carry around in my head a thinking that she needs my help, is scared and unsure of herself and I need (ed) to be more accepting. She even asked me "will you take care of me" early in the relationship.

But there is no doubt whatsoever that her words and actions were verbally and emotionally abusive, none whatsoever.

So Andy, I'm glad you wrote out that list. I think we both are trauma-bonded.
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« Reply #48 on: November 07, 2020, 07:55:36 PM »

I hadnt realised until i wrote it down just how toxic and oppressive our relationship was.
And believe me,  thats the tip of the iceberg, i could tell things that would make people question my sanity for putting up with them.
I know completely that she will never change, her ex husband was constantly vilified by her yet he is happily remarried to a lovely girl so her demonisation of him now appears so false
I should have taken more notice of one of her friends( not a close friend, she had none of those) who said, she sucks the life out of men, dumps them and replaces them and you will be no different ...



Andy. My ex constantly vilified her ex-husband too. Constantly. She would forward his texts to me, forward his emails to me, call me three times in a day to discuss what a jerk he was. She told me all sorts of stories about how "he was an abusive Narcissisist". For the last 6 months of our relationship, that's almost all she would call or text me about. For the record, in any of his communications to her I didn't see anything at all that was abusive, angry, threatening, or even mean.

And, unless she changed 180 degrees from that relationship, I simply cannot see how she was the poor, abused little wife. I simply can't see it. She was aggressive with me, gaslighting with me, condescending, angry, yelled at me, called me names, put my friends and businesss down, made fun of me, mocked me, mimicked my voice when she was yelling at me and I was trying to calm her down, etc. etc.

What does that tell you/me?  I'm not sure.
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« Reply #49 on: November 07, 2020, 09:30:41 PM »

I know in my case I have had enough of it. 
Ya I still care for her but honestly that’s just being human.
I have been through it all except being actually physically killed (obvious because I’m typing haha.)
 I see some friends who tolerated me and my frantic ramblings about the situation the past few years and actually feel the need to apologize and thank them for not banishing me.
   And I know all relationships have the ups and downs.
I do have to say I am touched and same time jealous with the simple touch and “honeys” I witness. And these are long term relationships I see this in.
That comfortable ease of acceptance of the other.
I used to think I had that. But I probably confuse the few moments of affection after caving on issues  as teamwork.
Relationships are teamwork.
(What am I a life coach haha).
But really. These relationships we speak of are abusive.
I had my moments I admit when I was cornered that I reacted with verbal anger and tried to leave which usually escalated the situation. (Understand why now due  to this site)
I try to rationalize now that I really just didn’t understand why it was happening. Why every damn moment had to be so topsy turvy and now now now. Need this now. Do this now.
  All I can say is alone is better then being used.
Maybe that’s incorrect terminology but basically it’s like being used like toilet paper.
  One day I’ll be divorced officially. But deprogramming slowly feels better. I can do this. You can do this.
And for solace. They’ll be just fine. Worlds full of suckers.


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Andy1963
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« Reply #50 on: November 08, 2020, 05:31:58 AM »

I totally agree Jaded about the trauma bonding
My head 100% realises that she was incapable of ever providing the balance and nurturing required to sustain a relationship,  she has a terrible track record of broken relationships alll of which she blamed on her exes.
The guy she broke up with before me was apparently a narcissist?
Her ex husband was a cheater and a liar etc etc
When we first got together she was still living in the same house as her ex fiance, they needed to sell the house for both to be able to move on and buy other property but it was a big house and was slow in selling
So she still lived there for the first 6 months of our relationship
I called her one time and she was in the middle of an argument with him, i could hear some of what was being said
At one point i heard him shouting ' does this new man of yours have any idea what he is letting himself in for?'
At the time I had only a slight clue based on a couple of experiences,  but I soon learned what he had meant.
Also, I found out after she left that she was regularly still having sex with him whilst living there.  I had suspected this as she was often late meeting me and would come up with nonsensical excuses for her lateness. When I showed that I wasnt happy about it she would get nasty and agressive, I now realise this was her shame projecting to deflect her guilt
I found out many other disturbing things about her which highlighted her flawed character,  the fact that her youngest son was from her affair with her husband's brother( only her and the brother know this) and yet she would constantly berate her ex husband if he didn't pay promptly for additional childcare costs etc
The long time affair with the much older man, she had sex with him for money regularly,  I only found out by accident as she was very good at hiding facts

I have said before that I believe it was my gradual distancing from her due to all of this chipping away at me that led to her finding a new source
She could see the signs that i was struggling with many aspects, I did still love her, I still fancied her( she is an incredibly attractive woman) but I was starting to have real problems reconciling all of her flaws and abusive behaviour with my feelings and attraction to her
You are right, my head and my heart are in opposition
Thats something I'm really still struggling with...
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« Reply #51 on: November 08, 2020, 07:12:40 PM »

Wow.  This is all so familiar!   

I’m over on the boards for trying to save my marriage, but since my wife left 5 weeks ago she has blocked me and filed for divorce.  I suspect she has moved in with a man.  I came over here because I’m starting to lose hope of us getting back together. 

As far as the gifts go a few Christmas’s ago I bought my wife (we were living together but not married then) a set of amazing diamond earrings that cost about $1800.  I thought they were the best gift imaginable.  She was disappointed.  She liked them but she wanted an engagement ring.

8 months into no contact, these boards have probably saved my life.

I simply had had enough and after the last verbal assault on me, after she ghosted me before and then ditched me over Christmas because, apparently, my gift for her LAST Christmas was "stupid" and "sh*tty" (and this doesn't even begin to touch the surface of things she's said to me). Oh, and by the way, I had just paid $115 for tickets to her son's holiday theater show and volunteered to be an usher for it the week before. She just ghosted me, then left town. Me sitting with her Christmas gift alone on my couch Christmas Eve- I didn't even know where she was. I was so excited to give that gift to her.

Something inside me changed. How could she just not say a word to me for days, pack up her car, and leave town for Christmas at her parents (who both had told me they couldn't wait to have me up) without saying a WORD to me?

These boards are filled with so many stories, so many similar experiences, that it makes us feel less alone. And sometimes that's what it takes to get through the day.
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jaded7
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« Reply #52 on: November 11, 2020, 08:43:51 AM »

@Andy and others

My head 100% realises that she was incapable of ever providing the balance and nurturing required to sustain a relationship,  she has a terrible track record of broken relationships alll of which she blamed on her exes.
The guy she broke up with before me was apparently a narcissist?
Her ex husband was a cheater and a liar etc etc


Terrible track record of broken relationships, ex was a narcissist.

Yep, as I mentioned earlier, same here. She bragged to me that she ditched a guy in a hotel room in Vancouver, BC, dumped some other guy off on the side of the road (she tried to do that to me in the dark and rain on a busy highway after pulling violently off the road during a yelling episode), she told me that a previous boyfriend killed himself after a "fight" with her and blamed her in his suicide letter-and by the way, 'fights' with her were ALWAY her attacking me for something I did or something I was, me trying to point out the facts, asking her where that came from; ALWAYS if I asked her, kindly, why she wasn't keeping a commitment she made, or if I turned her down for sex, or if she violated a boundary I set, or if I asked her to stay on the phone to talk more after she had ghosted me for several days ("you trying to start a fight?")

Ex was narcissist. Constantly telling me that, although I could see no evidence of it in his communications with her (which I mentioned earlier she always forwarded to me and was a MAJOR topic of conversation). Always calling, texting to tell me the latest horrible thing he'd done, which I never could see was so horrible, or even bad.
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Andy1963
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« Reply #53 on: November 13, 2020, 02:04:59 AM »

Im really beginning to worry that theres is something strange going on
So, a few weeks ago Im met a girl at a friends house( she is a friend of a friend if his)
We chatted and got on really well, she knows a bit about my experience but we didnt speak about it to any degree.
Anyway,  shes gorgeous,  intelligent,  normal, funny and we really seemed to click
She lives quite far away and was visiting our city to see her friend, but we exchanged numbers to keep in touch
So since then we've exchanged messages and spoke a few times on the phone,  sometimes staying on for almost two hours at times
So, last night we spoke , again for about two hours, and the conversation developed into her telling me she had told some of her friends about me and that she would be keen to meet up for dinner etc in a couple of weeks ( our respective areas are in mini lockdown until Dec)
It was a lovely conversation and we agreed that when lockdown was over we are going to meet.
Now, why am I telling all of this
Well, after the phone call I felt really good for the first time in months, I got myself organised to head to bed and was feeling so much better than i have for ages
I then made the decision,  right,now is the time to block my ex, so i lifted my phone to do the blocking and literally as i lifted it, ping, a message  from my ex, ( asking if I'm ok...again)
I mean, wtf?...are they psychic, this is the second time I've had the resolve to block and she does this
I know I should have blocked her already
Madness...


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Andy1963
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« Reply #54 on: November 13, 2020, 01:49:32 PM »

So after my strict adherence to NC we were in full dialogue today
She apologised profusely for hurting me and actually said she misses me
Not sure what to make of any of this but I've backed of communication now
I had totally believed i would never hear from her again after the last time
I certainly didnt expect the apology
Its once again knocked me off balance,  i know all of you will say i should have blocked her,  every time i was about to this has happened
Im just completely baffled
I can only guess that her new supply isnt what she was hoping
After our last communication there was nothing more to be said so why contact me...so confused
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« Reply #55 on: November 13, 2020, 03:07:56 PM »

I know Andy, same psychic sense with my ex.  It was uncanny, as if somehow there was a link to the two of us that he felt was broken and then he would contact me...as my contact always came the night of a great date with my now boyfriend.

And let me say this, any reconnecting in my situation felt AMAZING. Like a high almost. Which is why for me, if I was going to have a chance at a healthy relationship I had to block. I did and didn’t look back.

Unless she’s in treatment for BPD, actively accepting and understanding her diagnosis, you and her will repeat the same discard cycle if you got back together.

Remember that list you wrote of things you don’t like and how you were treated. Despite everything she just told you, she’s still that person.
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« Reply #56 on: November 13, 2020, 03:16:33 PM »

Thankyou Hopeless
Yes youre totally right
I need to keep focus on the reality of who she is
I guess i had so completely believed I would never hear from her again that I lost discipline
I know all the reasons she is bad for me, and that if she is contacting me its about her not me
I will build up the strength to block again
Spoke to my best friend tonight who is furious with me for not blocking her already
Shes reeling you in again, he said...
Need to focus on all I've learnt on here
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« Reply #57 on: November 14, 2020, 07:06:18 AM »

The dialogue descended into her glitching again
It had been amicable and apologetic from her.
Then suddenly she brings up my FB post from months ago, we had already exhausted that
It was a stark reminder to me of who she really is and why I'm better off out of this
I am a bit shell shocked again but I've only myself to blame for engagimg
They really are deeply disturbed people ...
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« Reply #58 on: November 14, 2020, 09:50:23 AM »

That was pretty fast after reconnecting for her to glitch!
How did you two end the conversation? What do you want to do now?

I wanted to say something about your friend being furious about you not blocking her.

Unless you have been in a relationship with a pwBPD, you absolutely DO NOT get it. They don’t get the draw, addiction, passion, manipulation or brainwashing. When normal relationships end there isn’t a need to block. When a BPD relationship ends the need to block is often due to horrible behavior towards you and giving you an opportunity to heal.

The last recycle with my exBPD, I told no one. Five months of a secret relationship. Like we were having an affair but we weren’t. I couldn’t handle the disappointment and judgement from friends or family. I just couldn’t. I get it.

So, be easy on yourself Andy.  You will block when/if you’re ready.

And in the meantime, we’re here for you.
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« Reply #59 on: November 14, 2020, 10:01:24 AM »

No one understands,  everyone just says forget about her, move on
Im trying so hard.
I didn't invite this latest contact, i was sticking firmly to my plan
The conversation was basically her apologising, saying she didnt mean to hurt me, that she missed having me in her life
I just highlighted how difficult it was for me and admittedly I said it was difficult adjust to not having her in my life.
All seemed calm and amicable.

I went to sleep but this morning woke to a message she had sent in the  early hours asking why i had put that horrible post on FB and that she didnt deserve it
We had exhausted that subject months ago and i thought she had acccepted my side of things, she said she understood. Clearly not.

So my reply today was to reiterate what I'd said before and to point out that i don't feel i deserved how she had made me feel when she did what she did.
That neither of us were perfect
Have heard nothing more
Is this what recycling really feels like, after our last communication i truly believed i wouldn't hear from her again
I know i shouldn't have engaged but its really difficult
My head and heart are still out of synch, however this has brought a bit more perspective
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« Reply #60 on: November 14, 2020, 01:10:07 PM »

I actually believe this engagement has helped me truly see how unwell she is
I have mentioned before that she did some things during our relationship which most would people think i was totally crazy to put up with.
But her sudden glitch last night after an amicable and calm exchange,  has reminded me of the many many times she would do that when we were often in a good place
Her manic episodes and bizarre reactions to small insignificant events often had me completely flummoxed.
Her inability to rationalize and see things from anything other than her skewed perspective was so difficult to deal with.
In glitch mode she absolutely could not be reasoned with.
Im a very calm and patient person, she used to say that she loved how patient I am, but no matter how calmly or rationally I tried to resolve things it was impossible when Martha( my name for her glitch mode) was in control
I had forgotten just how stressful those episodes were, but receiving that message after the ones that had came before brought all of those feelings back.
I read somewhere that you shouldn't try to over explain to someone with BPD, i was often guilty of that, but she seemed incapable of understanding anything i was trying to say
So in some ways this has been a good thing, because my heart needs reminding of how hard it was at times.
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« Reply #61 on: November 14, 2020, 04:28:00 PM »

Hi Andy

I’m glad to hear that the latest engagement with her has helped bring things back for you and refocus your memory on the reality of her being a very unwell person. I often felt that way too after similar exchanges but also found that feeling/memory to fade and then to become overshadowed by my good memories of my pwBPD.

I’m so encouraged by your ability to have met someone and the possibility of a meet up post-lockdown. That’s such a positive step which I hope leads to a new chapter, which you are so deserving of.

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« Reply #62 on: November 14, 2020, 07:33:52 PM »

I sound like my mom.
But...
better days ahead.
It’s true. 
Time heals all wounds. 
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« Reply #63 on: November 15, 2020, 10:49:21 AM »

Oh my gosh. I hadn't checked in a few days.

This sounds like, in my unprofessional opinion, EXACTLY what happens. A period of happy, loving communication and togetherness, then BACK to the old ways.

As someone pointed out, think back to that list. Reread it. And know that more of that is probably coming. I can't say for sure, but it likely is. Some has already started.

I understand how happy it can make you to feel her reach out, someone else mentioned how deleriously happy they were when their ex reached out...I would feel the same if mine did.

Here's what I KNOW. I KNOW what she said to me, what she did to me. I KNOW it's disrespectful, aggressive, mean, verbally abusive, emotionally abusive, sexually abusive (I've written about this on my early threads when I came here), self-centered, patronizing, condescending. YET...I ache for her, still. So I get this.

You may be in a position to have a more objective look at this. Like you, I was just totally trashed the last time we spoke- just horrible, horrible name calling and putting down and gaslighting that my head was spinning trying to keep the facts straight and the conversation on track. This has left me for 9 months just stewing and ruminating.

You now may have more 'closure' in your head, I don't know.
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« Reply #64 on: November 15, 2020, 11:16:44 AM »

Thankyou you all for your comments and input
Its actually been quite cathartic for me, for weeks I've been secretly wishing I had communication with her again whilst sticking to the NC
On both occasions when i had reached the point of blocking she communicates
First time set me back enormously,  but this has been different
I was in a good place and perhaps that brought more perspective
However I shouldn't have engaged
But the apology,  her saying she misses me lulled me into a false sense of security
I replied with not dissimilar language without actually saying I missed her
Thats probably all she was looking for, to keep me as an option, clearly the new relationship isn't fulfilling or perhaps she's glitched with him , I would be astonished if she hasnt already
But her glitching with me so quickly,  moving from apology and contrition to her self centeredness jolted me back to reality
Suddenly I could remember how horrible she made me feel on so many occasions
All I have right now are negative thoughts about her
It has made my journey just a little  more bearable
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« Reply #65 on: November 16, 2020, 11:45:55 AM »

Reading this thread has made me realize that, while I often think of my position (as a sibling) as different from that of people in romantic relationships, there are a number of real similarities, including my wanting to think that things are better/getting better/going to get better.  There are ways in which some things have gotten better, but the progress is nowhere near as much as I want to believe.  I lull myself into a false sense of security, lower my boundaries and then am devastated when the other shoe drops.  I do not want to exit, but I do need to get real and stay real about what this can look like.  Loving with open eyes is hard -- for me at least.
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« Reply #66 on: November 17, 2020, 09:04:56 AM »

Let me add a bit of what I’ve found with regard to your first statements on the thread:  BPD is often blamed on upbringing, or childhood trauma.  My former BPD'd partner had none.  From the books and research I’ve done, I confidently feel it’s a hard-wired, permanent condition.  I’ve witnessed several arguments around here over that, but the latest research convinced me.

What I’ve noticed is the BPD'd person’s behavior kicks in early enough to begin causing conflict and serious problems sooner than later.  Their sexual teasing for attention and validation is no doubt at the core of most sexual trauma.  Mine had dwelt on her sexual traumas with a dream-like trance, recalling and describing them in detail.  Not what I’d expect if such situations had not been either desired or initiated.  

I forget the term for their breaks with reality, or disassociated thinking, but had both witnessed, and had her thoughts described by my BPDx.  I suspect you’ve run across this, and is likely the behavior she described as being ‘brought up differently.’  I suspect, due to her periodic breaks with reality, that she ‘felt’ she’d been brought up differently, as her feelings didn’t match those of others.  (we’re all brought up differently).

You mention feeling codependent.  Something to self assess.  I suggest you work on yourself, figure out and attempt to correct that about yourself you feel, or know needs work.  Allowing yourself to settle for those incapable of legitimately demanding you improve will not help you advance in life.  If you did improve yourself, you’d be stuck carrying them through life.  Or, they'd resent your progress and attempt to sabotage it.  

You’ve mentioned going NC (no contact), and that she continues attempting to contact you.  ...I realize my conclusions and answers around here may not be ‘PC,’ but they are what I’ve concluded after a very bumpy ride..  Those with BPD appear to build a ‘stable’ (like that of horses) of relationship potentials - past, present, and future - and bounce between them.  To each, through mirroring, they become ‘a different person.’  

Since they realize early that ‘they are different,’ they feel that difference entities them to operate outside social norms.  Since they can only last so long, faking their behavior, or become overwhelmed with the normal expectations of a healthy mate, they’ve an expiration date (that’s rarely shared with you).  So they move on to the next admirer.  

As the new r/s begins to wear out, and there’s no new prospects - there’s always you!  They know you, your weaknesses, and exactly how to reinsert themself into your life (for another round).
 
I made the most serious move of my life, not specifically to get away from her, but she was definitely a contributing factor.  At that, I was contacted by her numerous times and ways.  I never responded.  Yes, I’d have liked to.  And in the past, had.  Thus, seven breakups.  No more.  

It’s not cruel on our part to stay removed from their lives.  They had their chance.  Often, many chances..  And like the drug I’d compare their effect on us -- we must forever avoid it.  They are stalkers, expect that.  Mine would describe what her many ex’s were up to Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post)  

Drama is nourishment to them, so starve them.  If you don’t, they will consume you ..in order to feed themselves.  They know they are messed up, and once they realize you know that, have no restraints on their behavior.  I finally considered my BPDx dangerous.  

Moving on, ‘normal’ takes time.  It seems as though you’re moving at a snails pace r/s wise.  Kind of like enjoying an apple, as compared to a tablespoon of raw sugar.  You must detox to the point where the apple tastes perfect.  Your BPD ex will not like that, and look to poison (hopefully not literally) your new r/s.  So be aware of that.  And, be careful about describing your BPD experience to a ‘normal woman.’  It’s nothing to brag about..  

Learn what you can, but contrary to any other opinion, BPD can not be fixed.  I found it could not be lived with, or tolerated, either.  When they’ve decided to leave, a desperation consumes them.  And when they leave, the fact ‘they broke it off’ appears to give them the impression it’s OK for them to decide to return.  It’s not.  That would be your decision.  And if you’ve experienced enough, learned enough, and need it to remain over - you will need to defend your decision.  Please do  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #67 on: November 17, 2020, 01:39:40 PM »

Thankyou Inside
This makes a lot of sense to me
Especially when it comes to her disassociation and breaks with reality
These episodes were numerous and actually quite frightening in their strength, its quite hard to explain to someone how it felt when these particular glitches happened,  it wasnt about rage at these times, more about experiencing something completely surreal

She would seem to become a completely different person, unrecognisable, it was hard to reach her and reason her back to some sort of balance. I feared those episodes even more than the rages as it made me realise just how unstable she actually was.
I would often say to myself during these episodes,  ' shes afraid of the world'
Because thats how it felt, extreme over reactions and paranoia were a constant theme.
Its becoming more and more clear as each day passes just how unwell she is and that I was just part of the process of the condition
That doesn't necessarily take the pain away but it at least reassures me that nothing I did could have helped or changed things
But it sometimes makes me fear for her well being...


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« Reply #68 on: November 18, 2020, 08:59:19 AM »

I’m sorry you and everyone on this site is in such pain!  The anger we feel is legitimate because what they have put us through. The sad thing is that the BP in our life have a personality disorder they are not doing this to get us, they are trying to end the constant pain that they live in. They just go from one person to another in hopes that the next person they meet will be the one that ends their suffering. When your in the throws of the disorder, you may be the one that they go after, but if read about this disorder, it not really about you. We can move on and try to get over what we went through, but there is no escape for them unless they are willing to seek help.  They are desperate people.  That being said, we don’t deserve the abuse and we need to take care of ourselves.

A few people on this site have mentioned someone who use to post who goes by 2010. It was hard to figure out how to get to his posts and I’m not sure how I finally found them, but after messing around I finally did. I was able to pull up all his post and read them one after another. He must be a therapist or professional in the field. I wish he was still on the site, he hasn’t posted for a few years.
 
I hope things start to fall in place, so you can start healing.
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« Reply #69 on: November 18, 2020, 10:01:01 AM »

Excellent summation, Andy.  I’d concluded the same from my experience.  I so vividly recall watching the disassociation wash over ..and through her.  Staring into space, while thinking out loud.  Honesty, I appreciated her allowing me to witness that, though ultimately concluded the same as you..

I evolved during our r/s, she didn’t, and unfortunately, couldn’t.  Eventually, she’d simply describe her fears, once I’d apparently convinced her I cared, and understood.  But in doing so, we both concluded, our r/s had likely run it’s course… 

I’d fill one, maybe two needs, as she then felt free to go elsewhere for any others.  Feeling I needed and deserved more, I concluded we’d reached the extent of relationship's capability, and I called it quits, for good.  She, in a narcissistic way, could not accept that ‘I’d’ made the call, and not (as usual) her.  She instantly ghosted me..

The only reason I’d contacted her was to seek money (yes, stupid me) I’d loaned her to purchase a house.  “Do not contact me again or I will obtain a restraining order” was her written (and mailed) reply!  Fortunately, I could afford the loss, eventually realizing, I’d dodged a cannon ball, and it was worth every cent to be rid of her.

Of course, she used every known angle to reinsert herself into my life; I needed only to remind myself of ‘that letter.’  No Contact, at all, ever since.

I totally understand the pain of others, though.  Thus have returned to these pages to reassure the extended victims they're correct in their fears, confusion, anger, and desire to escape.  You appear to have figured it out, and are capable of taking your ‘superpower’ of knowledge and moving ahead. 

As for them, they’ll do what they do, until their sexual allure wanes..  Yes, it’s tragic that no one could save or even help them, beyond the temporary fix they feel from ‘new love.’  Dang
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« Reply #70 on: November 19, 2020, 05:24:54 PM »

Ive decided to take a short break from the boards
I'm so grateful for all the input I've had here
Its truly helped me
But I feel I need to stop focusing on her and the relationship and spend some time looking after me
I will be back,   just taking some time out to refocus
Chat soon everyone
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« Reply #71 on: November 20, 2020, 12:30:26 PM »

Andy,

I've decided to scale back on my time spent in here as well to help my mind focus on other things besides BPD. I believe I've learned enough here on the forum and in therapy to be able to make the right choices to move forward in a positive way and  to not allow my ex to come back into my life.

Now I just need to focus on what's ahead in life for my child and I. My child is having to do virtual learning at home due to Covid for a while, so I have three roles now: employee, father, and teaching assistant. These things need to be my primary focus now, not my past relationship.

Best wishes, and I look forward to hearing about your progress in the near future.  
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« Reply #72 on: November 22, 2020, 07:20:44 PM »

Ive been here nearly 3 years, the support has always been a click away, it has been reassuring and reliable. I learned the help is Not going anywhere. some time for absorption can help. finding balance, remembering that life is bigger than the relationship. take care, see you, and if not - well done.
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« Reply #73 on: November 22, 2020, 08:44:31 PM »

I think you both should be very proud of your progress. Even in a normal relationship there is a period of mourning. Keep up the good work and give yourself some slack, this isn’t easy!
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« Reply #74 on: December 18, 2020, 03:46:46 AM »

So, its a month almost to the day since my last post announcing a break from here.
In the last four days my world has gone crazy.
For the first few weeks since that date I was focused, working hard on myself and distancing myself as much as possible from thoughts of her and the relationship.
Every week or so I received a message from her, innocuous usually,  asking how I was etc, I did reply, foolishly I suppose, but it never progressed past a few messages back and forth.
Then.....Monday of this week everything changed.
I was sitting at home after a busy day and unwinding when my phone pinged, it was her with the message ' hi, fancy meeting an old friend for coffee?'
Now I know and knew that my reaction should have been to ignore and not respond,  but I responded saying yes
Within 30 mins I was across a table in the coffee shop looking straight at her for the first time since September
We actually looked at eachother without speaking for what seemed like an eternity but it was only moments.
Her first words to me were, 'omg you look amazing'
I reciprocated,  and thats when my world became totally crazy again
All of the work and energy I had put into distancing myself went out the window
I asked her how her relationship was going,  ' I'm so bored' she said ' I miss you, I miss us, I've made a huge mistake '
I won't go into detail about how the rest of our meeting went as it was a blur and by midnight, when she had left my apartment,  I stood in the middle of my room and said to myself ' What the hell are you doing?'
So now, 4 days later , she is back in my life, albeit not in a ' relationship ' but we are reconnected.
My head feels as if its going to explode and I know I'm not thinking straight,  maybe it was a mistake coming away from here when I did, I thought I was strong enough, clearly I am not
Please don't judge me to harshly
But any input is welcomed.....
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« Reply #75 on: December 18, 2020, 08:42:08 AM »

Andy,
No one here is going to judge you! Share your feelings. Sometimes writing down your  thoughts, puts things in perspective. Maybe read what you wrote as if someone else wrote it. What would you tell them? What ever you would say, I’m sure it would be kind and caring.
B53
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« Reply #76 on: December 18, 2020, 09:00:28 AM »

Thankyou B53
I'm just feeling a bit unbalanced at the moment
I truly didn't expect any of this as I believed that she was gone forever and I was doing so very well at rebuilding
I guess, because of that I hadn't prepared myself for the possibility of her returning and for this engagement to happen, although all the guidance and advice on BPD should have alerted me to the possibility
In a bit of a haze tbh
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« Reply #77 on: December 21, 2020, 07:00:17 PM »

Finding life a bit surreal at the moment
Like I'm in a time loop
She is contacting me daily, love bombing me again
My friends and family are corralling me at present
How can they have such an effect on us?
Have I learnt nothing???
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« Reply #78 on: December 21, 2020, 10:55:46 PM »

Hi Andy! No one here is judging you, we are glad you are here. She’s like a drug, I get it completely. That feeling that she’s back and she wants you, it’s amazing. I’ve been there.

Remember, both she and your relationship hasn’t miraculously been fixed. You are in essence back in the same relationship, only with some damage done due to the past breakup.

What do you want to do now?

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« Reply #79 on: December 22, 2020, 12:21:33 AM »

Finding life a bit surreal at the moment
Like I'm in a time loop
She is contacting me daily, love bombing me again
My friends and family are corralling me at present
How can they have such an effect on us?
Have I learnt nothing???

They know our vulnerabilities and our core deficits. They fill our insecurities. We feel whole for the first time. We have met our perfect match. But then things change. The reason it's so hard to pull away/leave or resist them is because they filled the insecure, empty, lost parts of our soul.  To have that filled feels so wonderful. So complete. If only their motives were genuine.  The reason it hurts so bad is because we thought we finally found our soul mate. To have that same person who made us feel this way only turn around and cheat on us, lie to us, abuse us is traumatic. It not only damages our self worth, it not only exposes our holes which were temporarily filled, it validates them in our mind. Maybe we are the problem? Maybe I'm the issue? Maybe the way I felt all these years and my lack of self worth is because I'm actually worthless? 

Of course this could not be further from the truth. The key to not returning is to realize that the only true source to fill your wounded soul is YOU. Not an external source. We are attracted to them because they make us feel whole but we were not whole even when we met them and their actions to fill those voids were not genuine. If they were how could they have treated us this way?

They come back when they sense you are going to fill those holes on your own through no contact. Because once they get filled by YOU, they know their game won't work.  Someone with a healthy self worth, self respect, self love, doesn't fall for someone telling them how great they are because they don't need to be told that. They already feel good about themselves. In that process their games don't work anymore. Love bombing only works when there are holes that we let be filled externally vs internally.

They come back the way they do to prevent you from healing. For as long as it takes you to realize that the only person who can make you feel whole is you, you will be susceptible to them trying to come back into your life.  Even if you are away from them through NC for years if the realization is never made that the only person who can supply your self worth, respect, and expectations for how you are treated is YOU, than they will always have an angle because they know those holes are still there inside you and that we as humans will always fall for them being filled because of our universal desire to find love. 

I started reframing her love bombing as insulting. OK, you cheated on me lied to me, scream at me, ignore me for days, ruined my birthday but you love me? No. That's not love.

Almost like a con man who realizes you're on to them, she left me alone when she realized that I had done work on myself and didn't need HER or her hollow words to complete me anymore. 

If you aren't at this point yet that's ok but I do hope what I said above resonates in some way. Took me a long time to realize how I felt about myself, I mean look what I tolerated? And it took me a long time to realize that I needed to fix me, not our relationship that she destroyed multiple times.
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« Reply #80 on: December 22, 2020, 12:21:17 PM »

That was so well said!  Way to go! (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #81 on: December 23, 2020, 09:02:31 AM »

Thankyou Anxiety for your very detailed response.
I do feel really torn at the moment, she is urging me for another chance, she's accepting that she needs help and that she has hurt me very badly.
But I am very very aware of the fact that this is all about her.
Her new relationship hasn't worked out( because she is bored) and she is basically recycling me as I am familiar territory for her.
She is framing it as some sort of epiphany and accepts that I absolutely refuse to get into a relationship based on my past experience so I believe she is willing to settle for a resumption of communication , for now
Someone asked me a while back on here if I wanted her back
Truth be told, if I could remove her glitches and lying she is absolutely the girl of my dreams, beautiful, funny and full of life.
But, and its a big but, her BPD is so destructive,
She is glitchy even now but in a very transparent and harmless way
I had forgotten aspects of her personality and her quirks etc
The biggest issue for me right now is lack of preparation for this resumption of contact.
I truly believed she had gone forever, the guy she was with had everything materially that she has always wanted, he's a pretty rich guy and could have given her a very comfortable life
She has said that her priorities have been completely realigned as she now realises how amazing I was to her( although again I realise this is part of the ritual)
So I really going to think very carefully about things
The positive thing is, it is now totally within my control, which is very liberating



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« Reply #82 on: December 24, 2020, 02:20:08 AM »

Thankyou Anxiety for your very detailed response.
I do feel really torn at the moment, she is urging me for another chance, she's accepting that she needs help and that she has hurt me very badly.
But I am very very aware of the fact that this is all about her.
Her new relationship hasn't worked out( because she is bored) and she is basically recycling me as I am familiar territory for her.
She is framing it as some sort of epiphany and accepts that I absolutely refuse to get into a relationship based on my past experience so I believe she is willing to settle for a resumption of communication , for now
Someone asked me a while back on here if I wanted her back
Truth be told, if I could remove her glitches and lying she is absolutely the girl of my dreams, beautiful, funny and full of life.
But, and its a big but, her BPD is so destructive,
She is glitchy even now but in a very transparent and harmless way
I had forgotten aspects of her personality and her quirks etc
The biggest issue for me right now is lack of preparation for this resumption of contact.
I truly believed she had gone forever, the guy she was with had everything materially that she has always wanted, he's a pretty rich guy and could have given her a very comfortable life
She has said that her priorities have been completely realigned as she now realises how amazing I was to her( although again I realise this is part of the ritual)
So I really going to think very carefully about things
The positive thing is, it is now totally within my control, which is very liberating

I understand it is hard. There is not a single person on Earth who could have told me to stay away from my ex despite everything that happened. This process is something that every person has to learn for themselves. If you are back or go back what I would challenge you to do is this. Write down today, exactly what transpired during your last break up. Write down exactly the things she did, the things she said and the way it all made you feel. Write it all down in detail and at the bottom make an agreement with yourself that if anything like that ever occurs again, it will be the last time. You won't ever go through it again. That you have too many dreams, too much respect for yourself, and life is too short to have such highs and lows become your normal cycle of life.  Then put that letter somewhere safe and give it your best shot. You know I can't tell you going back is right but I also will not judge you for doing so because I did as well. All I can do is be here and try to provide some wisdom. They say wisdom is getting advice so that you can learn things without actually having to experience the learning process yourself. When I read your story and others here I just have this desire to help anyone who needs it so that they can learn from my experience and hopefully make their situation better without having to suffer as long as I did by actually having to learn it through repetitive hurt.

My ex reached out to me 1 month after we first split. My heart raced. She told me she missed me she wanted to see me. She said she realized so much. I had made so much progress up to that point I was out with a friend of mine when I got her texts and they took me by such surprise. 5 hours later I was in her bed. 10 hours later we were going away for the weekend together and were back into our previous cycle of seeing each other daily as if nothing had changed. Pay attention to this: There is a difference of saying all the right things to make a relationship work and saying all the right things to get you back.  It was like the twilight zone for me. It was like these people have a hack into your soul and know your heart better than you. It was a few weeks later. The very day I woke up and let my guard down as if to say to myself ok, I'm ready to go all back into this again she is different. That very day she started shifting back to her old ways. It was like she could sense I was back intune and hooked back into her which is an instant que to begin doing all the things she did before. 

Once all the nonsense started again I had done exactly what I suggest of you above. I took out that letter I wrote, read all of the things she had done to me I read how I told myself if it started again I would not go through this again.  Those are the lowest moments for me. I felt conned, I realized I was back to day 1 again of rebuilding myself and that was a tough pill.

I wish the best for you in this process. Just remember, we set the expectations for how other people treat us. If someone treats us poorly and we go back, or we stay or we dismiss and ignore it all we are doing is giving them permission without consequence. 

Take care of YOU and be well. If and when the cycle begins to restart, find that letter I hope you write to yourself and I'll be here to talk if you need to!


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« Reply #83 on: December 24, 2020, 05:33:27 PM »

Once again thankyou for this it is a very powerful message
I have spent almost 4 months focusing on healing and getting through a very traumatic break up, her getting into something almost immediately and how painful it has all been
But it has taught me just how strong I actually am
I have had some very dark moments during that time
I have posted about those dark moments whilst in the midst of them
But I got through them and emerged stronger
Now, all of a sudden she is back in my life
The one overriding thought that has emerged for me in the last few days is how much she really does need help
Her love bombing has progressed to her telling me she is missing me desperately every minute of the day, she rang me in tears saying she can't get through Xmas day without me there
I cannot and will not be there
This goes beyond her BPD and I am genuinely concerned for her well being, its not normal to ignore someone for 4 months then all of a sudden crave them desperately
My head is spinning with the madness of it all

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« Reply #84 on: December 24, 2020, 10:56:54 PM »

I’m on job contract multiple stop/ state road trip by myself.
It’s understandable I couldn’t get a worker to go with me, it is the holidays. I jumped on this contract. I may be an old guy climbing around like a spider doing this covid exterior work.
   But I love the banter. Not mine... the normal people just walking into the take out windows to get their food.
(Seems they always want extra rolls.)
  So it’s Christmas Eve.
 Again.
But this year after several years of insanity i have been discarded and left alone in a good way.
I did email a simple “merry Christmas!”
But I honestly only have a slight interest in a response.
   I know that confusing but let me simplify.
It’s over. She doesn’t even bother anymore. 
And THAT is the hardest to acclimate to.
That’s the rewiring you all speak of.
It’s happening.
 
  So anyway. Take care my friends.
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« Reply #85 on: December 24, 2020, 11:03:36 PM »

Oh damn andy I just kinda cut over your post.
   So ya. I have been there.
Ya she is up and large and demanded you just f@@@ing be there right f@@ing this instant even though that is realistically impossible even for the United States Air Force.
And your getting barraged and screamed and ranted at while you yell back to heard but no one is listening.
    ......right...... well I have been there.... and maybe once or twice... during those situations I actually just started laughing that I knew this was insanity.  The push me pull you of abuse.
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« Reply #86 on: December 24, 2020, 11:13:30 PM »

I’m  posting from my work truck outside a hotel on Christmas Eve.  My adult daughter is safe and happy, my bills are payed and current. My dogs are being babysitted.
  And I’m ok. Last year I was a total mess.
Am I ok. Probably not. I don’t seem to have a problem communicating with multiple perfect strangers, managers, staff,  oh like the General population. 
  But after being told I am a “sick man” etc for years I do have a inability to EVER want to deal with someone thinking treating someone like that acceptable.
   And I don’t see it out here. So I know it’s when you let them “in”.
So that’s my next hurdle. Or not.
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« Reply #87 on: December 25, 2020, 01:56:53 AM »

I’m on job contract multiple stop/ state road trip by myself.
It’s understandable I couldn’t get a worker to go with me, it is the holidays. I jumped on this contract. I may be an old guy climbing around like a spider doing this covid exterior work.
   But I love the banter. Not mine... the normal people just walking into the take out windows to get their food.
(Seems they always want extra rolls.)
  So it’s Christmas Eve.
 Again.
But this year after several years of insanity i have been discarded and left alone in a good way.
I did email a simple “merry Christmas!”
But I honestly only have a slight interest in a response.
   I know that confusing but let me simplify.
It’s over. She doesn’t even bother anymore. 
And THAT is the hardest to acclimate to.
That’s the rewiring you all speak of.
It’s happening.
 
  So anyway. Take care my friends.

I hear you. Think of it this way though. Life is about perspective. An event is just an event. We can view that event in such a way as to make it one way or the challenge is to reframe it. 

My ex too is gone for good. She has left me alone completely now for years. No apology, no happy birthday no realization that she was wrong, nothing.  Once I finally broke free I was never going back but I have to admit at first a part of me craved that one day she would come back just to say sorry or everything. Closure. I can choose to view it that way but then it occurred to me.  Her leaving me alone is a testament to my resolve as she realized I would not fall for her games again. Her never reaching out ever again and apologizing is not a reflection of my inadequacy it's just further proof that what what I know is love was never what she offered. Her leaving me alone is just proof that I was strong enough to get away. Her never reaching out to me is more a fact that she can not handle rejection and she now fears me and the fact that I would reject her attempts to come back.

So we can choose to somehow summarize that the person who emotionally abused us, lied to us, cheated on us and disrespected us going silent is somehow a reflection on us.  But if it is, it's only because we are healthy now and aren't willing to rescue them.

We didn't lose. We won back the freedom to move on.
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« Reply #88 on: December 25, 2020, 09:47:49 PM »

anxiety5,
well said!
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« Reply #89 on: December 25, 2020, 10:25:50 PM »

anxiety5,
well said!

Merry Christmas!
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« Reply #90 on: December 28, 2020, 05:35:36 PM »

anxiety5, Thanks for saying just what I needed to hear.
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« Reply #91 on: December 28, 2020, 11:28:11 PM »

anxiety5, Thanks for saying just what I needed to hear.

You are welcome. I hope you have a great evening!
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« Reply #92 on: December 30, 2020, 06:43:54 PM »

In a million years I didn't expect to be in this place
We are now back in  relationship,  she is making me promises continuously
But, I am absolutely not sucked into her game
Im being very very cautious and am in no way allowing myself to believe this will be different
Ive decided to enjoy aspects of it but with the complete realisation of who and what she is
This is actually very cathartic and when it ends,  and I know it will, it will be on my terms
For months she was gone, and I believed it was forever
Now she is telling me shes planning our future together
I am doing everything I can to maintain balance
This place has been my haven, hopefully the wisdom on here will keep me sane
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« Reply #93 on: December 31, 2020, 08:05:50 PM »

Glitch number 1 already
We really are not going to get too far
Im seriously concerned for her well being
But what can I do?
I can't even begin to explain how crazy she is its bizarre
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« Reply #94 on: January 04, 2021, 12:28:43 AM »

Andy,

No offence, but what did you expect? Your post previous to this suggested you knew what was coming, and now it has started to come. The question should be "what am I going to do to protect myself from the storm ahead".
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« Reply #95 on: January 09, 2021, 05:13:14 PM »

You are absolutely right grumpydonut
What i will say is that she seems determined to overcome this
That glitch led to an intense conversation,  I explained my position in depth and held nothing back
She has agreed to therapy
Im still very cautious about all of this
I know more now than I ever did how delicate her condition is,
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« Reply #96 on: January 09, 2021, 05:32:35 PM »

I kinda commend you and her.
Seems your not being abused at this time so that’s good.
Seems she acknowledges there is a mental issue playing out.
Seems you two can rationally discuss it.
Well now I’m just envious haha, I didn’t understand what was going on mentally until a couple of years into the insanity that played out. Had I known how to respond or not respond maybe it would have been less destructive.
I do wish all involved the best. There is always hope.
 I have no contact with my ex. But our daughter does talk with her again. My ex has been employed again and has even talked with her immediate family. So things seem to be stability in her life. That’s good enough for me. I am glad to hear it. I wish her nothing but happiness.
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« Reply #97 on: January 09, 2021, 08:51:40 PM »

Perhaps I'm just a pessimist, but this all reads like someone with borderline using a "commitment" to therapy as a way to draw you back in.

One of the common themes from reading through this forum is that a person suffering with borderline must want to go to therapy purely for themselves in order for them to stick to that commitment. This doesn't sound like what is happening.

Andy, obviously I am no expert and I hope for you that my opinion is wrong, but this sounds like a trap.
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« Reply #98 on: January 09, 2021, 09:02:35 PM »

The thing I find interesting is the actual admission there is a problem involving mental health. I never got that and never will.
All I get is “you have no idea what you have done”.
I don’t want to re live it all and I am by far not perfect and I know what’ll I had done. Scramble, plead and pay dearly.
So I just find it interesting that there could be a rational discussion of the situation. I never experienced that. So I don’t want to put in false hope just seems rational to talk it out 
I would say “what do you have to lose” but that seems too relevant to current events.
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« Reply #99 on: January 10, 2021, 11:01:15 AM »

That's fair, Goosey. I had the opposite thing happen. Mine visited a therapist, but only to keep my by her side until her replacement was ready.

As for what does Andy have to lose. A lot - time, self respect, self esteem.
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« Reply #100 on: January 10, 2021, 11:57:21 AM »

I was being sarcastic. I shouldn’t be flippant I apologize
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« Reply #101 on: January 10, 2021, 01:16:27 PM »

I agree with you Donut, and it’s coming from a place of wanting  to protect Andy since we have been there and know how this often turns out. My expwBPD discarded me more than once while in therapy. I went back after recycles with my eyes wide open and guarded = I fell back in love and was brainwashed quickly.

We are here Andy, when/if you need us. Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #102 on: January 13, 2021, 12:09:01 AM »

Staff only

This thread has reached its post limit and has been locked. The discussion continues here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=348024.0
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